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**Gene** · 10-21-2002, 12:07 AM

Joe,

These never existed.

**Joseph D'Errico** · 10-21-2002, 12:48 AM

Hi Gene, I'm confused to my knowledge Goring instituted a modified badge in 1944 which included the the number of engagements at the bottom of the wreath with a number shield. At the end of the war their were five classes of the badge 25, 50, 75 and 100. Foreman's also has the 25 engagements for $2,500.00. Is this incorrect? John Angolia, states that while these numbered pieces were put into production their is no record of them ever being awarded proir to the end of war.
Thanks
JD

**Adrian Stevenson** · 10-21-2002, 03:59 AM

Numbered badges

Hi Joe, both you and Gene are correct. The badges were instituted but never reached production. We have talked about these in the past. Do a search and you should find the thread?
Cheers, Ade.

**Prosper Keating** · 10-21-2002, 04:11 AM

Instituted in November 1944. No photographic, documentary or contemporary hearsay evidence that it was ever awarded, even on paper. Not a single Fallschirmjäger veteran I know and have known - several dozen down the years - remembered anyone ever receiving a numbered LW Ground Combat Badge, an LW Panzer Badge or an LW Close Combat Clasp. If you search through this forum, you will find threads about it, including one where an award document shown in a book beside an 'original' 25 Erdkampfabzeichen by a wellknown author of reference books is exposed as a fake. Save your money for something rare but genuine.

Prosper Keating

**Joseph D'Errico** · 10-21-2002, 07:46 AM

Thank you, for clearing the air, I will check out the thread you mentioned. I was doing some research on LW badges and was thumbing through some referance material and saw that the badges were said to be produced, but not awarded. Initially I thought the same as Gene, as well as the other two badges mentioned by Prosper. Therefore these were not even produced, correct??
Thanks Again
JD

**Jürg** · 10-21-2002, 07:58 AM

LW ground combat badge for 25 engagements

Helmut Weitze is offering a "original" piece on his website. Price is Euro 3850.-- maker marked "R.K." I also thought that no photo evidence is known for proof that this badge was really handed out. I don't understand why he is putting such a questionable piece on his sales list? Check it out, the piece has the sale number 19462

Jürg

**Gene** · 10-21-2002, 08:55 AM

Jürg,

We have a simple saying around here, courtesy of François: "Not for my collection". And not for yours either, my friend.

**Joseph D'Errico** · 10-21-2002, 12:18 PM

Hi Jürg, I just checked out Helmut Weitze LW 25 it looks just like the example shown in Foremans. But that's too much cabbage for this guy and ultra rare questionable examples are too riskey. I think that Gene and I are are the same page here. Interesting though as of late it seems like more and more of the ultra rare pieces are becoming available. I wonder if this is do to higher quality repos and supply and demand or just some of the older collectors selling off some pieces or both.
Thanks
JD

**Rick Research** · 10-21-2002, 12:49 PM

Some of those older collectors have no ethical difficulty in fobbing off fairy Tales Can Come True on a younger generation. By now, a lot of "old" repros are starting to acquire some "authentic" looking age. Steer clear of the dubious stuff-- there is WAY too much original stuff out there to fall into the High Priced "Trophy" trap.

And THAT is the basic lure of all the "exotic" stuff. Comes down not only to financial reality, but philosophy--

what are you collecting, and why?

"Investment" in fantasy items for "prestige" (odd how the SELLERS are always gonna tell you how "smart" you are...) is The Worst way to go.

The problem with BAD parts of "good enough" "Reference" Books is that... edition after edition after edition... the same old errors are repeated again and again and again. "Oh, it'll all be fixed in the next edition..." almost invariably turns into... there never IS a second edition, or the same old mistakes are simply repeated forever.

A whole kitnkaboodle of self-perpetuating mistakes would be preveneted if authors simply got it right the FIRST time before rushing into print and figuring on "clearing up" LATER. That is all to common, alas, but it is also the Space Shuttle Challenger Method of Publishing.

**IVAN** · 10-21-2002, 02:09 PM

Hi to all,

please, look my thread to Association Members Only Forum section.

Ivan

**Joseph D'Errico** · 10-21-2002, 07:06 PM

Well said Rick, thanks for posting, as well as the other memebers. Don't mind me if I post these threads on questionable pieces, I just feel that it's to everyones benefit.
JD/Kermit

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LW 25 Ground Combat Badge

LW 25 Ground Combat Badge

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