blue-painted M-38 SD

[Kenny Suit]

Were M-38 SD FJ helmets ever painted in rough textured dark blue paint?

I'm well aware that SD and ND M-40 and M-42 LW helmets were painted in a dark blue color, but all of the SD and ND M-38 FJ helmets I've seen are dark green.

I would love to have a dark blue one if they exist.

Do they? If so, what percentage of these helmets would you estimate were painted dark blue? And approximately when would they have been produced?

(I'm referring generally to "dark blue" or "dark green" helmets -- I don't want to start a quarrel about the shade variations within these basic colors!)

-- Kenny

[Willi Z.]

Hi Kenny, I can say without any doubt that you will not see any original blue-gray M38 helmets. From the first M36's they were green-gray. Some very late war helmets were in a slate gray.

One of the many FJ myths that persisted in various publications, until the early 1990s, are these blue-gray FJ helmets.

[francis006]

Willi send you a mail

[John Hodgin]

Mon ami, je vous enverrai une note.
Regards,
john

[Kenny Suit]

yes, but...

Thanks for your replies.

Several of my reference books state that M-38 helmets were issued (circa 1940) in a rough textured blue-gray paint. Goodapple, Vol. 2 (p.20) mentions this, and Baer (1985; p. 227) even refers to an order specifying that blue-gray paint was to be used. Both sources say that this color was soon superceded by green-gray paint.

I've spoken to several collectors who say they have (or have had) blue-gray M-38 helmets in their collections, but I've never actually seen one of these examples. I also can't remember seeing any photographs of blue-gray helmets in reference books.

I suppose this contradiction (evidence from reference books versus lack of evidence from actual helmets) is why I am asking the question that started this thread.

So... can someone give me a quick summary of the development of this "myth" (the myth of the blue-gray M-38) and how it came to be debunked? What references do we have that prove this color was never used, for instance. And why would the LW not have standardized their paint colors on all of their helmets (M-35, 38, 40, and 42)? Any other comments that forum members would like to make on this issue would be very welcome.

-- Kenny

[Willi Z.]

Kenny, there are many mistakes in books.

The earliest M36, M37 and M38 FJ helmets were in apple green. After that came a smooth gray-green then a dull gray-green.

I welcome a discussion on this matter.

Here is a photo of a helmet shell that Francis had. Perhaps he can comment some more. He had stated that he felt it was repainted and had a coat of green underneath the blue-gray.

JohnB states he thinks one of his helmets is blue-gray. Perhaps he can give us a better shot, as the shots of that helmet in Brana"s second set of helmet books does not leave me with the impression that it is blue-gray.

You never know.........so, let us see what members have and know.

[francis006]

Hi Willi,

Yes indeed, i have had this shell and rivets and sold it many years ago . Before having it ,i knew it since may be around 20 years but as time is passing so fast ,i don't remember exactly all the dates and sadly not sure about the little detail about the paint under.The guy pulled out the inside as the leather and the chintraps were rotten , awaiting to find better pieces .the shell stayed like this many years and when i kept it ,it was impossible to unscrew the bolts so i sold it .
I can tell you the shell was not green but smooth blue grey ,a very resistant and factory like paint and as i said ,in my memory ,may be it was early apple green under but after these years i'm not so sure .The shell showed sign of heavy use and eagle was "washed" but still on the paint as you can see.
Sorry but this bad scan of an old photo is the only proof i have
So i also hope another member has an exemple to show

Francis

[JohnB]

Gentlemen,

I have an M-38 helmet that may qualify as having Luft blue factory paint on it. I finally have some photos. Tell me if you think I am colorblind.

BTW this helmet once belonged to Steve Dukes and Jerome Blake. I have a grainy pic from the 1970s sent to me by Landy Hardy and this helmet is in the picture.

[JohnB]

Another pic.

[JohnB]

one more

[Willi Z.]

John, didn't you once show me that helmet?

BTW, I think it is green.

[JohnB]

Willi,

Yes you have seen this helmet, probably 5-6 years ago at GP's. The photos are just not that good.
John