Ss fj

[Angel Farré]

Are these men SS FJ?

Surfing the net I found this photo and I think they are SS men.

What do you think?

Angel

[John Hodgin]

Are these men SS FJ?

Surfing the net I found this photo and I think they are SS men.

What do you think?

Angel

They are, and the dark spots on their splinter jump smocks is rain.

[Gerry Cummins]

Angel,

This photo was taken on Heldengedenktag 1945 (Memory of Heroes Day or Memorial Day) in Neustrelitz. The Fallschirmjäger are assigned to a company of the newly formed SS-Fallschirmjäger-Bataillon 600. On this day, they are serving as an Honor Guard to pay respect to their fallen camrades.

You can find much more information at the following link:
http://forum.panzer-archiv.de/viewto...r=asc&start=15

I hope this will be useful.

Gerry

[clint-magnum]

They are, and the dark spots on their splinter jump smocks is rain.

Smocks (splinter or TW) with eagles removed or never applied ??
does someone have an idea ?

[Gerry Cummins]

I've seen many different copies of the Heldengedenktag photos and I'm convinced that they are wearing splinter smocks. But, as hard as I've tried, I can't see any brest eagles. I don't know whether the LW eagles were removed (a common practice according to Siegfried Milius) or were just never applied. And, I'm not sure how we will ever know the answer to that question ... as it applies to this picture, anyway.

Wish I had a better answer for you.

Gerry

[Angel Farré]

Thanks a lot for the info, I am not a FJ collector but always take a look into this section and found interesting info so when I see the photo I need to know who are those soldiers and where they are and you have answer both.

Thanks again

Angel

[Willi Z.]

Thanks for the information Gerry.

As to the question of smock eagles; IMO they have been removed.

[Gerry Cummins]

I'm with you Willi. I think these smocks, like those issued to SS-FJ-Btl 500 in 1944, probably came with the breast eagle attached and the SS-FJs removed the offending LW adler. My only hesitation is that removing the adler was an individual act. As a result, most pictures that I've seen have at least one SS-FJ still wearing the LW adler that came with the smock. The Heldengedenktag photos are unique to me, though, in that every adler seems to have been removed; at least, I can't seem to find a single breast eagle in any of the pictures that I've seen of that ceremony. And, for my money that goes against the odds. On the other hand, maybe the discipline in that company was so good that every manner dutifully removed the LW adler before the ceremony. Who knows? It's just fun speculating.

Gerry

[Gerry Cummins]

Since we're talking about jump smocks and adlers, here is one of my favorite SS-FJ portraits ( http://cachespell2.rssing.com/chan-2122977/all_p14.html ). The photograph is the third from the bottom of the page and it features "an SS-Fallschirmjägerwearingthe thirdpattern Splinter B jump smock" with an SS adler on the sleeve. Rare indeed!

Gerry

[clint-magnum]

Since we're talking about jump smocks and adlers, here is one of my favorite SS-FJ portraits ( http://cachespell2.rssing.com/chan-2122977/all_p14.html ). The photograph is the third from the bottom of the page and it features "an SS-Fallschirmjägerwearingthe thirdpattern Splinter B jump smock" with an SS adler on the sleeve. Rare indeed!

Gerry

One of the coolest. Curious to know if that eagle was handsewn or machinesewn.

[Willi Z.]

Gerry, that is a great photo!!

My guess would be hand applied.

[Ironcrown]

I agree. The eagles were factory applied, so I believe that they were sent to the units in the same way. IMHO modifications as removal/addition of eagles was done in place by the single paratrooper or maybe by a local tailor.

[Gerry Cummins]

I'm in complete agreement with you both - Willi, Ironcrown. The SS-adler was surely sewn on by hand. No commercial manufacturer of jump smocks would ever have shipped such a flagrant uniform violation to the field. Instead, I'm sure it was the handiwork of some overly enthusiastic SS-Fallschirmjäger sitting around the barracks with time on his hands. All you have to do is look at any country's paratroopers to see how many decorate their uniforms with that little something extra just to stand out in a crowd. It seems to be a universal trait of paratroopers.

Gerry

[Gerry Cummins]

I need to make a correction to the information that I provided in post #2 above. I relied on secondary sources and failed to conduct a thorough fact check before I submitted my post. My bad ... and I apologize to those of you who have been following this thread. So here goes; here's my correction.

1. These two photos (links below) were definitely taken during a memorial ceremony conducted by SS-Fallschirmjäger-Bataillon 600 in Neustrelitz during the Nov/Dec timeframe ... just not Heldengedenktag 1945.
http://i11.tinypic.com/2my9lrq.jpghttp://i10.tinypic.com/34e8gnt.jpg

2. I should not have referred to the ceremony as Heldengedenktag 1945 ... for a couple of reasons. First of all, Heldengedenktag (Heroes Memorial Day) is a state holiday set by the Nazis for 16 March when that date falls on a Sunday, or for the Sunday previous to that date. So, what we are looking at cannot be the state sanctioned Heldengedenktag. That ceremony would have taken place on Sunday, 12 March 1944 (when SS-FJ-Btl 500 was conducting anti-partisan operations in Bosnia and Serbia ... not in Neustrelitz). Furthermore, it could not have been Heldengedenktag 1945 because that ceremony would have taken place on Sunday, 11 March 1945 (when SS-FJ-Btl 600 was conducting defensive operatioins in the Zehden bridgehead along the Oder River ... again not in Neustrelitz).

3. Although I still do not know the proper German or English name for this ceremony, I do know that it took place in Neustrelitz sometime in the mid- to late November or early December timeframe. That much I know for sure. The SS-Fallschirmjägers were garrisoned in Neustrelitz in October 1944 following their successful participation in Operation Panzerfaust in Budapest. There they were reformed and refitted. And, on 1 Nov 1944, they were formally designated as SS-Fallschirmjäger-Bataillon 600. Then in December, two rifle companies departed Neustrelitz to support Otto Skorzeny's Panzerbrigade 150 during Operation Greif in the Ardennes. After that, in January 1945, the entire battalion was moved to Schwedt on the River Oder, never to return to Neustrelitz.

So, where does all of this leave us? Well, we know that these men were members of SS-Fallschirmjäger-Bataillon 600. They were conducting a ceremony in Neustrelitz in the rain in the Nov/Dec timeframe. They are wearing splinter jump smocks with no LW or SS adlers. And finally, we now know more about the state holiday Heldengedenktag then we ever wanted to know.

I don't know about you, but I need a beer right about now. Thanks for your patience.

Gerry

[Willi Z.]

Great information Gerry. Hope you enjoy that beer.....