Jump trousers question.

[SMP]

Hi,
Can anyone tell me why they made late war jump trousers with 2 different sized rear pockets. I own a pair which are similar to the pair owned by Chris Mason and shown in Kurtz's German paratroop book. The right rear pocket is made of twill and is covered with a large, button-down flap. The left rear pocket is smaller, rayon ,and has a small button-down flap. I have asked Willi if he could post my pictures so it should be clearer as to what i am refering .
My own guess is that rayon is used to line important pockets to help the removal of the object held within ....field dressing perhaps ?
Any information welcome,
Regards,

Steve Pledger.

BTW,all the press studs are PRYM 6 !

[Willi Z.]

Steve, here are your pictures of the pants. As we discussed a year of so before, the trousers are clearly original. The presence of the smaller pocket is unique on a later issue pair of trousers. Some have referred to the trousers with the smaller pocket on the left rear as M38 trousers, with the more normal ones being M40's. This just does not seem to sound logical. But, many do agree that the smaller pocket was used for the field dressing. What do the rest of you think?

Willi

[John Hodgin]

Jump Trousers

Hi Willi,

Have seen the small left rear pocket only on very late war trousers, so I can't imagine them as M-38's. All the pre war trouser's I have seen have same size, symetrical rear pockets. They are also much more green in color. Won't hazard a guess as to use of the smaller pocket.

Best,
John

[John Hodgin]

Jump trousers

Earlier pair.

[Willi Z.]

Hi John,

Yes, I agree that the early M38s are more green than the mid and late-war's which are more gray. My '41 dated pair still have alot of green in them. Not sure about the smaller pocket being late-war though....could be mid-war too. CM's pair have the cotton lining (usually associated with early and mid-war), instead of the later rayon lining, and have both snaps and buttons on the rear. Would agree about not wanting to guess what the smaller pocket was used for. Have heard some mention that it might be the field dressing. Steve, does the dressing fit in the pocket perfectly? Will see 3 FJ veterans next week and will ask if they recall the issue about pockets.

Willi

[Willi Z.]

Nice trousers John! What's the date on them?

Willi

[Gene]

Mine are marked LBA 3 43 and have equal size pockets and flaps

[John Hodgin]

jump trousers

Hi again Willi,

There is no date in this pair, just the size markings. The waist lining is green and the pockets are grey. A tiny piece of the paper tag remains. Don't think the cotton lining on Chris's means they are early to mid war. Have had several late 44 dated jump smocks with cotton twill wind cuffs, holster lining, and tape belt "tunnel." As you know these are usually rayon on smocks at this late period, BUT, not always. I still feel Chris's trousers are late war.

By the way, great trousers Steve!
regards,
John

[Willi Z.]

Hi again John,

Good point on the presence of cotton, rather than rayon, on some late-war smocks. I just looked at a mint 12-44 dated water pattern smock that had blue cotton wind cuffs. It is by far the exception, but as you mentioned, still something you see. Tough to know for sure when trouser lining went to rayon from cotton. Most think '43 was the transition date..again always exceptions. So, if in fact the smaller left rear pocket was a late-war feature of the jump trousers.........we still have no idea why they would have done that......

Gene, I too have a pair marked LBA 3 43. Many examples from that lot were brought home by veterans in mint condition. I must say that most of the FJ trousers I have seen were marked like that.

Willi

[SMP]

Hi Willi,
Cheers for the photos. With regard late war cotton lined jump smocks , i used to own a heavy duck cotton tan/water smock in the same "Italian" variant colours as the one you have in the Kurtz book. It had plastic RiRi zipps but blue cotton windcuffs and cotton waist band/holster/e-tool panels. So i guess rayon was the norm but cotton was also used.
As for the field dressing theory, i am told, although i do not know, that late war heer trousers also had a small left rear pocket,.Does anyone know if this is true ?
What size dressing did they carry, and i'll tell you if it fits.

Regards

Steve

[Willi Z.]

Hi Steve,

You are welcome..sorry it took so long to post. On the presence of the cotton twill windcuffs, the smock I saw was exactly as the same as the style you describe. The heavy cotton duck water pattern. The windcuffs, inside tape and flare holster lining were a deep blue light cotton twill, unlike the heavier cotton you find on the windcuffs of step-in smocks and early '42 dated 3rd model splinter smocks in the "splinter over olive" pattern. John, how does this match with what you have seen? I will get some photos of this smock in a week or so,

Willi

[John Hodgin]

Pockets...

Hello Willi,

The pockets are very different. The one I still have has olive twill wind cuffs and reed green HBT lower pockets. The upper pockets are olive twill but a different color from the cuffs. The smock is made from very heavy twill; it's the one with the subdued eagle. Cool eh?

[SMP]

Hi Willi,

Just to complicate the issue, the smock i was referring to had blue cotton windcuffs and inner button fly lining , but tan coloured
waist strip/pistol/e-tool lining.

Regards
Steve

P.S. good to get away from badges once in a while...and John, great photos !!

[Willi Z.]

Yes, it is good to get away from badges......zzzzzzz.........

Very cool John! Yes Steve, the more we look the more we find that the standard may apply to about 90% of smocks, but the rest is open to anything.

I have a mint '43 dated water pattern. A pattern that looks very "British" in camo colors....very unique. The front inner button fly lining is made from green cotton twill, but the other features are rayon. This smock also has the pocket linings made from splinter fabric. You have to look inside the pocket to see the splinter pattern, the back of the lining is just the olive green base color of the camo pattern.

Willi