Please help with para badge

[Eric Queen]

One of our members ( Paradet ) asked that I post this and request opinions / comments.

Thanks,

Eric

[ERIC S.]

Hi Eric,
IMO a Fake. Bad casting/pitting to the reverse - catch bronze? - awful funky smooshed rivits - and the topper:the Ges Gesch and hallmark? I personally have NEVER seen this type of hallmarked reverse on anything I've ever collected. Maybe others have - more opinions guys?
ERIC

[Prosper Keating]

No badge of this kind would be marked "Patent Applied For" or "Patent Pending" (Ges Gesch). One sees this mark on early NSDAP and party-related regalia sometimes...because the issuing authority had a patent application pending. The humble party badge is a classic example. But regalia thus-marked generally dates from the early to mid-1930s. No genuine German WW2 military qualification or combat badge would be marked "Ges Gesch". Anyway, apart from that, this badge is a repro, probably dating from the early to mid-1970s.

PK

[sshort]

Pitting

Zerstorer, You mentioned pitting when pointing out the obvious flaws with the above badge. Does pitting alone raise suspision if you can only see it with a loop and not the naked eye? I would appreciate anyone's opinion on this. Steve S

[ERIC S.]

Hi Steve,
If possible, I would also check other pieces by the same manufacturer to make sure that this is normal anomaly for their pieces. It could be a die characteristic or possibly have something to do with the type of base metal being used.
ERIC

[Frank Heukemes]

Well, parts of this ominous maker´s mark seem not to be so uncommon. Let me show you my Assmann marked RAD women´s silver class "Erinnerungsbrosche". It features partly the same marks. The question is, what is the meaning of the letters in this mark?

Cheers, Frank H.

[Frank Heukemes]

reverse

[paradet]

thanks munich you gave me a bit hope of thinking its something rare.............maybe you have a fake ,too?
regards Detlef
btw there is something scratched on the wreath on the back,maybe its a chance to find out some info?
Gefr. Lücke
März 1940
Nr.4124

[ERIC S.]

RADwJ

No Paradet, Frank's Erinnerungsbrosche for WOMEN is fine. The RAD j mark is an early (33-35) hallmark found on Reichsarbeitsdienstabzeichen ( STATE LABOR AWARDS), henceforth the initials RADJ ( J = Jugend or women). One will find this hallmark on early Assmann RAD badges rather frequently.
ERIC

[Frank Heukemes]

It seems to me that the whole maker mark on the Fallschirmjägerabz. might have been taken (cast) from a real RAD badge of some kind and was combined with the cast of the fake.

Cheers, Frank H.

[Willi Z.]

I hope this thread won't go on and on like the one on the luft pinon breast eagle on the other post. This badge is a fake, and a bad one at that. "Hoping" that something will turn out to be real, in others words, convincing yourself and others that something fake is real, is no way to collect. Why are all the badge guys on here so quiet on this one???

Willi Zahn

[Frank Heukemes]

Calm down, Willi, nobody ever said this badge is right except for the owner who still hopes it might be real. I just wanted to prove that parts of the maker´s mark itself are not completely bogus but do exist on other original Third Reich badges. Sorry if this was misinterpreted.

Apart from that, threads like this and the LW breast eagle thread are still interesting at least. They have the ability to teach you e.g. that original stickpins exist in the tens of thousands in 16mm.

Cheers, Frank H.

[Willi Z.]

Huh? I am extremely calm......... I did not misinterpret, or even challenge, your discussion/inclusion of the RAD badge. That RAD
badge confirms that those markings are pre-war and since that FJ badge is not intended to be a pre-war badge..makes it rather
clear. In regards to the rather lengthy discussion on the Luft metal pinback aluminum breast eagles, it has been knownfor the last 12-15yrs that this lot of large "A" bright and shiny aluminum eagles have been dumped, and continue to be dumped, on the market by the hundreds. Many on that thread stated that and were just ignored, while others tried to convince themselves that everyone else is wrong. All opinions are not equal in this hobby, some do spend alot of time and money to have their finger on the pulse of what is going on. Your snip about 16mm badges...well...as clearly stated in my coments, I do not claim to be an expert in little $50 stickpins. I honestly do not follow them.......you asked about 16mm FJ badges......I responded that I had not seen any that looked good...... I should not have taken that to assume that they were not any Heer types in 16mm. I honestly should not have commented on other 16mm pins.......cause I don't know nor do I care enough to even look at them at shows. My focus is on FJ items......and someone asked me about FJ stickpins.so I posted and commented on them. Since you know about 10s of thousands of 16mm stickpins, why have you not commented on their presence or absence in FJ badges? I just hate to see the FJ portion of this forum degrade down to "I know FJ badges cost $450 plus, but I got this one on ebay for $150 and I am hoping it is real, so any glimmer of hope despite what most say,is all I need to feel good about my clever purchase."

WZ

[François SAEZ]

Willi,
Is it possible, please, to post on the LW aluminium eagle what you have said here, just for everybody looking at the thread there to have an other experienced opinion.
Again thanks

François

[Mike Kenny]

Hi Willi,

The LW Para Badge at the top of this post is bad, a fake imo, as simple as that. I hadn't planned on saying anything as it had already been said.

Regarding the "big A" LW breast eagles, we obviously move in different circles. I simply have not heard that they are repros - and I'm not saying they aren't, I just have not heard it but uniform insignia (as opposed to badges/medals/awards) aren't really my thing. If you KNOW the real story, then please post it on that thread - I'm more than happy to learn the hard way and have not been pushing them as real. I would question your timing though as I've had one for 15 years and I'd seen the odd one or two for several years before that time as well.

And as for $150 LW Para Badges on eBay, I wouldn't know but it sounds a bit expensive from my experiences! My early tombak/nickel silver Deumer and zinc Assmann LW Para Badges both cost less than that!!

Regards
Mike K