How to start in Paper ID Collecting?

[William Eledge]

I am just starting out & have an interest in soldbuchs, drivers licenses & arbreitbuchs(along with a lot if other items!!).

During my reference book buying binge I have recently purchased the "Papers Please" book and I am studying it now.

Are there any other websites you can recommend to learn about these things?? I tried Gary T's site but apparently it is out of action. I am not sure if I will be able to attend the SOS in Feb, so the web is my current show/flea market......
Any dealers you can recommend for paper/ID items? I see a lot of these items on ebay but I KNOW I do NOT know enough yet to avoid fakes there.

Thanks, bill

[hucks216]

Try these...

http://www.soldbuchweb.com
Pt 1 - http://www.dererstezug.com/SoldbuchAnatomy1.htm
Pt 2 - http://www.dererstezug.com/SoldbuchAnatomy2.htm
Pt 3 - http://www.dererstezug.com/SoldbuchAnatomy3.htm

...and for publications...
A Collector's Guide To World War II German Wehrpasses & Soldbuchs by Emilie Caldwell Stewart
Collecting World War II German Military Pay & Service Books (ISBN:1-905142-10-2) by Nigel Allison (Ulric Of England)
Wehrpass by Emilie Caldwell Stewart
German Third Reich Era Documents VOL 1 - Paramilitary & Civil Organisations (ISBN:0-9666122-0-5) by Jeffrey F Young & Daniel W Meinz
German Third Reich Era Documents VOL 2 - Military (ISBN:0-9666122-1-3) by Jeffrey F Young & Daniel W Meinz
German Third Reich Era Documents VOL 3 - Special Edition (ISBN:0-9666122-2-1) by by Jeffrey F Young & Daniel W Meinz

..and numerous others that help you determine Orders Of Battle, who commanded where and when, signatures etc. And don't forget to refer to the Pinned threads at the top of this section.

[Admiraal]

I suggest buying a few very cheap soldbücher (for example with no awards or with removed photo) to learn from and get the feeling how they are.

[JeremyJ]

..

I would second Rick's comments about inexpensive Soldbuchs. Part of the journey in determining the authenticity of documents is to determine how they were filled in and what should or should not be in the ID's.

Whether you have a flieger with no awards and only training units or a Knights Cross winner in a fighter squadron the same basic information, stamps, method(s) of filling in and characteristics of signatures should fall under the same criteria.

A good library for researching and cross referencing is a must to research these items, and as Hucks tagged there are some valuable websites as well.

This forum is one of the better for learning as well as showing pieces in question to get a baseline for what is good or not. The volume of ID's displayed here will begin to give you an idea of what to look for and some of the frequent techniques employed by forgers.

Personally I think Ebay long ago gave up having anything worth going after and now serves as a dumping ground for fake or over priced items to more novice collectors.

All that said researching real items is great fun (and a huge time consumer) and worth the investment of time and money.

Regards

Jeremy

[CWP]

I would have a look at the E-Stand and see what interests you there. Pick up some cheap examples and if you have any questions, post here for discussion. Original paperwork has a certain "look" and with time you will learn to recognize what may not be right. Start of small with basic and common items, don't make the mistake of going for the high-end stuff first or you run a serious risk of getting burned. All paperwork is unique and the endless variety makes it very enjoyable to collect. Have fun with it.

[Ausweis]

Sent you a PM

[William Eledge]

THANKS GUYS!!!!!

I am truly surprised at the very gracious offers of help I have received from this post by the members of this sub-forum!! Many Thanks!!!

[InfanterieSammler]

All great advice!

A few things that were imparted to me when I started that have proved helpful:

- Acquire 100% original, "textbook" pieces and study them to death.
- Buy quality over quantity. You will never regret buying a quality piece, the quantity will come with time.

I would further add:
-Try to specialize. No one can be an "expert" at everything. Find an area that appeals to you most and learn absolutely, positively everything you can about that area. For example, if you are going to collect Soldbücher/Wehrpäße, perhaps you can focus on a certain branch that appeals to you - I collect Army Infanterie/Grenadier items.
-Don't ignore the history. It sounds silly, but often a collector can become so focused on the minutiae of collecting a specific thing - learning every type, variant, etc. that he neglects learning the history as well. Find quality books about the history of the period - they will give you a broader context from which you will appreciate the items you own even more.
-If you are going to collect WWII German documents with any degree of seriousness - Mann muss Deutch lernen! I regret that I didn't complete the four year program, only doing two, while I was at college. The two years certainly helps me, but I still labor through long translations. Don't even get me started on handwriting.
-Get good reference material (see above posts), to include a German to English military dictionary.

Welcome aboard and have fun!
John

[Tora_Tora_Tora!]

I would add really to focuse yourself to read as well every single page of the due in each one there is a story and, specially, in many cases an human being.
This is a great field and you will find more than nice people to help you and suggest you in your steps.

[William Eledge]

All great advice!

A few things that were imparted to me when I started that have proved helpful:

- Acquire 100% original, "textbook" pieces and study them to death.
- Buy quality over quantity. You will never regret buying a quality piece, the quantity will come with time.

I would further add:
-Try to specialize. No one can be an "expert" at everything. Find an area that appeals to you most and learn absolutely, positively everything you can about that area. For example, if you are going to collect Soldbücher/Wehrpäße, perhaps you can focus on a certain branch that appeals to you - I collect Army Infanterie/Grenadier items.
-Don't ignore the history. It sounds silly, but often a collector can become so focused on the minutiae of collecting a specific thing - learning every type, variant, etc. that he neglects learning the history as well. Find quality books about the history of the period - they will give you a broader context from which you will appreciate the items you own even more.
-If you are going to collect WWII German documents with any degree of seriousness - Mann muss Deutch lernen! I regret that I didn't complete the four year program, only doing two, while I was at college. The two years certainly helps me, but I still labor through long translations. Don't even get me started on handwriting.
-Get good reference material (see above posts), to include a German to English military dictionary.

Welcome aboard and have fun!
John

I hadn't thought about the dictionary. I managed to survive 2 yrs of spanish in college but still can't order at the local mexican resturant....

[William Eledge]

I would add really to focuse yourself to read as well every single page of the due in each one there is a story and, specially, in many cases an human being.This is a great field and you will find more than nice people to help you and suggest you in your steps.

That is one of the attractions of this field.

[William Eledge]

THANKS GUYS!!!!!

I am truly surprised at the very gracious offers of help I have received from this post by the members of this sub-forum!! Many Thanks!!!

Once again, I TRULY appreciate the multiple offers of help I have received as a result of this post!!! THANK YOU ALL!!!!!!

[Jock Auld]

William,

You have picked a bad time to join the hobby.

There are many fakes poping up or bastardized paperwork!

There is much less around so you should try to focus as soon there will not be the quantity and you will pay through the nose for quality.

But you rightly identify that each book is its own story and part of history.

I have never focused as I am probably older than you and was constantly distracted (a fact recorded on my school report card) with what was available when I was younger.

To that end I will give you a few examples of lesser interesting books if you want but still remember it was someones life at the time!

Drop me a line!

Jock