SS Deutschland Rgt. Training units and Erk Markings

[Allectus]

Hello, I have been trying to do some research on the SS "Deutschland" Regiment and now I am trying to figure out some of the training units that supplied men to them...particularly 2.Kp. if any are known. I recently acquired an original Wehrpass to a guy who I believe was in 2. Kompanie along with 8. Kompanie and I am trying to figure out if the entry 2.(E) SS-"Deutschland" was his training unit or not? I am assuming the (E) part means Ersatz, is this correct? If so, would this be the unit that he and others would have received their Erkennungsmarken and if the same wording would have been used on it?

Does anyone have any information regarding original known "D" regiment training units along with Erkennungsmarken...either training or field unit marked? Particularly for the 1943-44 time frame?

Thanks to everyone for all the time and help, hopefully there are some answers to these questions!

Brett

[besslein]

yes "E" mean ersatz

[Allectus]

Thank you Besslein! So was this his training unit before being assigned to 2.Kp.? Would this be the same way his erk was marked? I'm just trying to sort out this Wehrpass and how their system worked. Thank you so much for the help!

Brett

[Frontalschaden]

Hello

You must differentiate between the 2.(E) SS "D" and the 2. SS "D" (or 8. SS "D")

On one hand you have the Ersatz Bataillon DEUTSCHLAND and on the other Hand you have the SS Regiment DEUTSCHLAND.

The Ersatz Bataillon SS "D" was in the homeland.(Or in this case in Prague) The main mission of this Ersatz Bataillon was to train young soldiers. (basic training) It was the replacement unit of soldiers, comming from the field-regiment SS "D" with woundings or something else, too. Normally all soldiers, while making their basic training in this unit, got their dogtags here. It is not important in which unit they were send later on, they got their (E) SS "D" dogtag !
It is quite possible that there were soldiers, serving in SS Regiment Deutschland with dogtags from the Ersatz Bataillon of the LAH. (while they made their basic training in the Ersatz Bataillon LAH)

On the other hand, you have the field regiment SS Regiment "D". All soldiers coming from basic training, wore their basic training dogtag (for example: 2.(E) SS "D") up to the end of the war. If you lost your (basic training unit) dogtag, than you got one from the field unit. (for example: 8. SS "D")



Best regards, Fronti

[Adr]

Can You share with us rest of the pages?

[Allectus]

Thank you so much for all the help Frontalschaden! The guy who this Wehrpass was issued to was once in the Polish Army and then to Deutschland Rgt....I am a bit curious also if the "E" part may have been a different training unit for guys who came from countries outside of Germany or if it was a standard training unit that anyone could have been sent to?

Here is the entry that initially I thought was his first assigned Kp. but perhaps this is just the info that lists what was on his ErK as it says? Would this info: SS "D" 2.Kp. 814 be what was on his Erk or would it have been the 2.(E) SS-"Deutschland" that was on it?



Here are some other pages that lists his units:





Im also a bit curious what the (R.) might mean next to his rank stamp for SS-Rottenfuhrer? I can not recall ever seeing that before.....does anyone know what this may have meant?



Thanks again to everyone for all the help with this. I really appreciate it!

Brett

[mr.dogtag]

Hmm... ended up in Rasse und Siedlungs Hauptamt...
Interesting
Al

[Allectus]

Yeah I thought so too....I heard that when guys were wounded severely enough to take them away from front line combat that they were often assigned there? Which coincides with his story I think. It is an interesting thing for me that he was assigned there since he was originally from Poland and not from Germany but perhaps this was a common occurrence....??

Brett

[mr.dogtag]

From Poland? His WMA was in Gleiwitz. Gleiwitz became Polish in 1945.

[Allectus]

Ahhh yep you are correct, my mistake! Looks like the three towns Gleiwitz/Gliwice, Hindenburg/Zabrze and Beuthen/Bytom in Silesia was German while the rest of Upper Silesia was Polish after the Third Silesian Uprising! I was a bit confused as he was in the Polish Army before the SS...Fascinating!

So this might be a dumb question but would his erk be marked exactly as it is shown under Nummer der Erkennungsmarke:

SS "D" 2.Kp.

Or would it have been like the stamp is on the other page:

2.(E) SS-"Deutschland"

Could it have been something different as well? Thanks again for the help in trying to figure this out!

Brett

[leibermuster]

Hello

You must differentiate between the 2.(E) SS "D" and the 2. SS "D" (or 8. SS "D")

On one hand you have the Ersatz Bataillon DEUTSCHLAND and on the other Hand you have the SS Regiment DEUTSCHLAND.

The Ersatz Bataillon SS "D" was in the homeland.(Or in this case in Prague) The main mission of this Ersatz Bataillon was to train young soldiers. (basic training) It was the replacement unit of soldiers, comming from the field-regiment SS "D" with woundings or something else, too. Normally all soldiers, while making their basic training in this unit, got their dogtags here. It is not important in which unit they were send later on, they got their (E) SS "D" dogtag !
It is quite possible that there were soldiers, serving in SS Regiment Deutschland with dogtags from the Ersatz Bataillon of the LAH. (while they made their basic training in the Ersatz Bataillon LAH)

On the other hand, you have the field regiment SS Regiment "D". All soldiers coming from basic training, wore their basic training dogtag (for example: 2.(E) SS "D") up to the end of the war. If you lost your (basic training unit) dogtag, than you got one from the field unit. (for example: 8. SS "D")



Best regards, Fronti

This of course makes sense, but wouldn't each new training session end up with the same numbers? It seems to make more sense to change your number once you left the replacement unit.

[Frontalschaden]

So this might be a dumb question but would his erk be marked exactly as it is shown under Nummer der Erkennungsmarke:

SS "D" 2.Kp.

Or would it have been like the stamp is on the other page:

2.(E) SS-"Deutschland"

Could it have been something different as well? Thanks again for the help in trying to figure this out!

Brett

Hello

This could be a mistake. Normally the soldier must have a 2. (E) SS "D" and not a SS "D" 2.Kp, while doing his basic training in the 2nd coy of the Ersatz bataillon "Deutschland". He never served in the 2nd coy of the SS Regiment "Deutschland", only in the 8th coy.

This of course makes sense, but wouldn't each new training session end up with the same numbers? It seems to make more sense to change your number once you left the replacement unit.

The unit who gave the dogtags, printing ongoing (don`t know the axact word. "on a rolling basis ?) numbers at the dogtags.
Example from the second coy of the ersatz bataillon "Deutschland":

First basic training in war (about 1939) -1- 2.(E) SS "D"

last basic training in war (about april/mai 1945: -11280- 2.(E) SS "D"

This is just an example. The 2.(E) SS "D" might have been given more or less than 11280 dogtags.

the number in front of the unit, between the - - (-1- or -11280-) is the personal number of the soldier. this is the style of writing of the WASt)



I will have a look at my database. I will give some picture examples later on. (At first I must do a search)



Best regards, Fronti

[Adr]

1939: SS-VT-Ers.-Sturmbann "Deutschland"
1940: SS-Ers.Btl. "Deutschland"
1941/42: SS-Inf.Ers.Btl. "Deutschland"
1943/45: SS-Pz.Gren.Ausb.u.Ers.Btl. 2

An early E SS D tags had been given shourtcut SS-VT. On late tags from the same unit we might find only the SS marks.


http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=72010

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtop...72010&start=90

[Allectus]

Thanks for the information! I am a bit confused though....So they would not use the E or (E) part on their erks? His WP says his Nummer der Erkennungsmarke was SS "D" 2.Kp. and 814 and it looks like he got it in 1940. The information you showed was:

1940: SS-Ers.Btl. "Deutschland"

Im confused which one would be on his erk then??

Im guessing that what you showed was the training battalion and that his Kompanie and information on his erk would have been the SS "D" 2.Kp. and 814. Is this correct?

Thanks again for posting those great links and providing that great information!

Brett

[Frontalschaden]

Hello

For the second time !

They use (E).

In this case it must be a mistake and he doesn`t get an E

On his dogtag was: -814- SS "D" 2.KP

Could also be a mistage of the writer of the Wehrpass and he forgot the E and the dogtag was: -814- 2. (E) SS "D" but the Wehrpass says: -814- 2. SS"D"

Write to the WASt, they could help you if the want, but there is only be a little chance, because most of the SS Archive (including most aof the dogtag lists) are burned.


Best regards