Captured Soldbuchs in US archives?

[jmark]

Hi all,

I'm trying to help a German friend of mine find the Soldbuch of his grandfather (Michael Kern). I know this is a long shot but I've promised to help him. Hern was captured by the Americans during the final months of the war and was released in July 1945. Upon his release, however, his Soldbuch was taken from him and in its place he was given some discharge papers. Unfortunately for my friend, these papers were destroyed soon after his grandfather's death in 1955. My friend is now desperate to find either his grandfather's original Soldbuch and/or a copy of the discharge papers.

What will perhaps make this a bit easier is the fact that one of Kern's friends - released on the very same day and also subject to confiscation of his Soldbuch - is still alive and still in possession of his discharge paper (attached below).

Does anyone have any clues about how I can begin this search? Do US archives still contain captured German documents, or were they destroyed once the relevant information had been collected from them. And would a copy of discharge papers still exist?

Thanks in advance
Jason Mark

- - -

PS. Here is the discharge paper of his friend.

[Rob E.]

Those are really good questions!

I look forward to seeing what info is presented here.

[Larry deZeng]

Does anyone have any clues about how I can begin this search? Do US archives still contain captured German documents, or were they destroyed once the relevant information had been collected from them. And would a copy of discharge papers still exist?

The only original German documents still in possession of NARA are the so-called Luftgau reports, folders, files on downed enemy aircraft. It used to be called RG 242/T1033 with some 650 boxes in all. But there are no German artifacts in these boxes - only U.S. artifacts.

In 31 years of trawling through the enormous WW II holdings of NARA, I never saw an original German document, much less a SB or WP. Does that mean there are none? Probably not, because in a lifetime of say 75 years of trawling through NARA's collection - just the WashDC collection, not the dozen or more regional archives - 10 hours a day, 6 days a week and 52 weeks a year, that hypothetical individual might be able to eyeball 1% of the total collection.

There is an oft repeated truism that compares the British National Archives with its American counterpart: "The Brits purged everything but what is left is beautifully and thoroughly indexed; the Americans, on the other hand, saved every last scrap of paper but there is almost no way to find anything." As someone who has "worked" both archives, I can attest to the accuracy of that statement.

--Larry

[Daniele C]

The only original German documents still in possession of NARA are the so-called Luftgau reports, folders, files on downed enemy aircraft. It used to be called RG 242/T1033 with some 650 boxes in all. But there are no German artifacts in these boxes - only U.S. artifacts.

In 31 years of trawling through the enormous WW II holdings of NARA, I never saw an original German document, much less a SB or WP. Does that mean there are none? Probably not, because in a lifetime of say 75 years of trawling through NARA's collection - just the WashDC collection, not the dozen or more regional archives - 10 hours a day, 6 days a week and 52 weeks a year, that hypothetical individual might be able to eyeball 1% of the total collection.

There is an oft repeated truism that compares the British National Archives with its American counterpart: "The Brits purged everything but what is left is beautifully and thoroughly indexed; the Americans, on the other hand, saved every last scrap of paper but there is almost no way to find anything." As someone who has "worked" both archives, I can attest to the accuracy of that statement.

--Larry

[McCulloh]

Well, maybe Captain Garnello is still alive. I'd try to start with him.

[Ian Jewison]

I contacted the National Archives here when trying to find one of my Uncle's Soldbuch around 15 years ago. It was taken from him when he arrived at Kempton (Racecourse!) Internement Camp late 1944.

According to the head of the Archives (PoW's), all related documents that were taken when the person went into British captivity was returned to Germany in the 1950's....where however I do not know and neither did he!

We contacted the Bundesarchiv, Deutsches Dienststelle and another Archive in Aachen. None of which had his Soldbuch and that was were we stopped......

I do know however that the French Government sent certain documents direct to family as I have letters with the Soldbuch stating "We are returning your/or family members Soldbuch"!

/Ian

[Ian Jewison]

....

[Doug Nash]

Soldbuchs in Archives

I can only second what Larry said. To give you an example, in 1987 when I attended the Army combined arms staff studies school at Ft. Leavenworth, the Command and Staff College library there held an enormous amount of stuff - books from the 1800s, photos, original records, etc. One item I saw was a complete original technical manual on the JU-388 aircraft - hundreds of pages of tech specs, wiring diagrams, 3-D exploded view drawings, and hundreds of photos showing the aircraft at the factory in various stages of its construction. But some of pages had fallen out and were laying on the floor between the stacks. I scooped them up and put them back in & then asked the librarian why this thing was even there and not at the USAF museum or why it had not been given back to Junkers. She just shrugged her shoulders and said that some veteran who had obtained it during the war gifted it to the libary and that was that. Since then, the library has moved all of that stuff to the restricted records section there along with all the original US operational records, but whether the JU-388 manual ever made it there is problematic. If anyone is interested, you can check out the Combined Arms Reference Library at http://www-cgsc.army.mil/carl/resources/ They also have a digital records collection with a lot of US Army WWII source material that's worth checking out.
Cheers,
Doug Nash

[Luftm40]

In my limited experience w/ NARA research into German soldiers, I have had success finding the service records of Heer officers and SS officer and enlisted personnel. In those cases, NARA had the complete records for these people on microfiche. Heer enlisted personnel would probably be a needle in a hay stack, if they exist in the NARA holdings at all. As an aside, when I attended the Naval War College in Newport RI I was impressed by their holdings of WWII US Navy artifacts. Much of the original correspondence pertaining to USN combat operations in WWII is held there and it is fascinating!