The Two S&L Dies for RK's

[tom hansen]

Interesting, Dave. Also stand a couple of feet back from your computer screen and take a look. Is this a "pre-blip"? It is the same shape as the blip noted above.

[Brian S]

A 'pre-blip'. We are really splitting the gnat's ass into 1/64's aren't we?

"So Herr FamousDealer, hast du ever sold an RK with a pre-blip mit dem provenance?"

"Nein! Kein pre-blips!"

"Ah, so, Collector Community, pre-blips MUST be fake. We have keine pre-blips mit dem provenance."

[George Stimson]

Is the "Herr FamousDealer" a fake?

Wouldn't the German plural of "pre-blip" be "pre-blipen"?

[Brian S]

Ja! Ja! Keine pre-blipen. Das hab' Ich nicht gesehen. Niemals. Nein.

[Dave Kane]

The "blip" is raised? So it could be filed off?

George, you sly bstrd......burnish the flat plane and it might disappear

When we chat about wear etc., Brian's Cross seems to fall in to the very late area of the 'dent row' so thus the interest in a time line!

The 'row' indeed is very flat and almost non-existant....from natural wear or just a worn out die?

[tom hansen]

That area appears to have the same shape as the "blip", but it is not raised, like the blip that Harry and Dietrich describe.


Could it be filed off as George suggested? Possibly. Maybe it is the beginning of the "blip". However, if we are looking a time line, particularly with attention to pre-1945 or post 1945, one theme that seems to ring true in this award, and others, is that the government cared about the appearance and quality of the pieces they were putting out. Post war- who cares about quality. Otherwise, unless there were standards that needed to be met, why repair/replace the S&L die? Got a blip? Grind it down. Both these would appear to be consistent with a firm trying to meet standards by maintaining the high quality appearance of the RK. Again, if it was post war, who cares about small imperfections such as die flaws and blips? Leave them there. Collectors and souvenier hunters would still buy them and there would be no sanctions from the governement for a lower quality piece.

[Dietrich Maerz]

First of all, the plural of "blip" would be "blipse". So the correct sentence woyuld be:

"Ja! Ja! Keine pre-blipse. Das hab' ich nicht gesehen. Niemals. Nein."

But apart from that, the blip had to start somewhere and somehow, so there was for sure an "early-blip" stage. A pre-blip stage is what I would call a cross with any blip whatsoever - like the 935-4. But that's semantics.
It is interesting that Brian's blip is located at exactly the same spot where the later blip appears. Conincidence? Maybe, maybe not. Since the blip on Brian's cross is eaqually visible on both sides, it's a die feature. So something happened there, that's clear.

Now the dent row really looks 'worn'! Compared to the 935-4 worlds apart.

Dietrich

[Dietrich Maerz]

Here is the dent row of a 800-4. The picture is bad since blown up, but one can clearly see the well defined dent roe - very close to the 935-4.

[Brian S]

Yes Dietrich it's a die 'flaw' as it's EXACTLY the same on both sides. Not something we'd see on a filed piece.

[Dietrich Maerz]

Brian,

I agree. Does not seem to be filed nor can I see any traces of something filed away.

What I really would like to see is a clear close up picture of the real blip. Maybe Harry can take a picture exactly of the same area you did. I still don't have a grasp on the shape and form and surrounding area of this blip!

Here is the dent row of a 935, declared by Detlev as postwar. Look how pristine the dent row is! Am I missing someting here?

Dietrich

[Dietrich Maerz]

Now here is the dent row of an early 57 S&L. Still clearly visible and defined.

[Dietrich Maerz]

Here is the S&L split as always requested by Dave It cleary is a B-Type S&L frame with an early 57 magnetic core with the flat numerals.

[Dietrich Maerz]

Here is the lower portion of the 9 o'clock arm. No blip, no pre-blip, no starting blip, nothing .

Go figure?

[Harry]

Detlev sold a S&L RK today as a post-war assembly piece, it had the blip. I cannot take any pics at the moment as I left my camera at my mum's house in Ireland......it will be a few weeks before I can retreive it

[Dietrich Maerz]

Buy a new one! How can you live with a camera for a few weeks??