Double marked EK1

[Douglas 5]

If I may ad one thing here ...... when was Zimmermann destroyed by the fire ?
Besides I cannot see Zimmermann having amounts of premade pins on hand hoping for future sale but rather do up an order and send it out - 1000 pins - lets say .
I can see Godet having a lot of pins on hand and them adding the mark . There are 2 font different 20 marking dies . One Godet used ( supplied by Zimmermann) and probably one BH Mayer used ?

Douglas

[Dietrich Maerz]

Hi Douglas,

the big attack was on 23. February 1945 in which 1/5 of the population died and 98% of the town was destroyed. C.E. Zimmermann's location was close to the center of the town.
Earlier attacks were only minor. It is fairly safe to assume that Zimmermann (and the others) ceased to exist as working companies after that date.

Dietrich

[Douglas 5]

Thanks Dietrich .... I had heard both : fire and bombing . Beside the oaks were any EK parts or pins salved from the site ?
I have not heard of any ... this devastating attack would mean Zimmermann did not assemble anything post war .
Any post war assembled parts/pins had to come from left over stock at Godet or BH Mayer .

Douglas

[Dietrich Maerz]

B.H. Mayer was also destroyed during that attack in Feruary 1945.

[streptile]

Beside the oaks were any EK parts or pins salved from the site ?

Lots of EK cores, frames, EK1 backplates, etc., can be found in the Zimmermann Fire Lots. Also RK and GK stuff.

[HeinzGrimberg]

Hi guys,

Trevor, what do you think about the pins with the double marking? I don't really see a scenario where a maker like Zimmermann would have a leftover pin marked with L/52 and then add a 20 to it postwar. I don't think anyone postwar would care about such things, especially "yanks". I tend to think most fakers would be happy just putting one single maker mark on a badge to try and increase its value postwar for collectors.

Tom

I agree with Tom.

Double marking are genuine? why?
that's not to same.

LDO marking + pkz marking is upgraded pieces? why??
that's wrong in collection, the failed cover up the incident?

certainly, LDO and PKZ not to same.
I think that just arouse one's interest.. ( the more the better?? )

BR
S.W

[HeinzGrimberg]

Lots of EK cores, frames, EK1 backplates, etc., can be found in the Zimmermann Fire Lots. Also RK and GK stuff.

that's the problem too.

The following decorations can be produced :

The evil dealer ( Hee, Hee )

Detached Origin Core + fake frame OR Detached Origin frame + fake Core

omg..

BR
S.W

[Douglas 5]

Thanks Dietrich . So Godet was not damaged and could have had left over cross components .

The Zimmermann fire must have been a cold fire .
The zinc Kvk 1 shows no damage of any kind !?? Silver melts at 962 degrees Celsius and Zink melts much lower at 420 degrees Celsius .
The Ni-alloy cross parts show quit a bit of heat damage . The zinc items seam untouched - not affected ?

Douglas

[Euronymous]

Zimmermann fire lots is a good proof the factory was bombed in February. And City of Pforzheim was a heap of ashes.

[Euronymous]

ONLY when they are double marked, the number "20" has a flaw (a lack of details) on the bottom of the 2. Among us, who noticed that ? I have checked several "20" crosses and I can tell you that you won't find this "2" with a flaw on a simple marked cross. Is there an explanation ?

Here is an exemple posted at the beginning of this thread:

[Douglas 5]

Your single marked cross .

Douglas

[Euronymous]

Douglas, Are you sure it's a CF Zimmermann frame ?

The "2" flaw on your photo is a bit different. See this photo:



You will see that a part of the "2" totally disappear on the bottom and always at the same place. Try to compare with others double marked crosses.

[streptile]

Your single marked cross .

Douglas

This one's a fake.

[Euronymous]

Yes Streptile, it's not a CF Zimmermann.

Douglas, I have never seen a simple marked "20" with the flaw in the "2". Only double marked crosses have that flaw in the number "2". Please check another crosses and let me know. I am wondering: Is there an explanation ?

[Douglas 5]

Hi Euronymous- took awhile to get back to your question and the simple answer I sent you required a proper follow up .
Just going by memory - as the original Zimmermann maker study was lost in a hard drive crash - I had to dig up the important components to your flaw question .
I am posting it as it may be of interest to some others . To start off the origin where I had seen that flawed 2 . .. is with the Zimmermann German Cross different grades .
A complete and the same flawed 20 you had questioned about . I pulled a few out and not that rare on GCs .

Douglas