German cross.......difficult one

[4xL]

Hello,

here i need some specialists for German crosses.
This cross is a mystery for me.
I know there exists different opinions with S&L crosses.
Some people say good another not good.
Here is a another example from a S&L german cross.
I think these cross have good chances to be a wartime made cross!
The collar looks like made of Cupal and i do not think this is made
postwar!
What do you think?

regards 4xL

[4xL]

another photo

[AndyC]

For me this cross is the typical postwar made S&L DKiG but wait for more inputs.

Andy

[Alex Bolotnikov]

Not a cross I would like to see in my collection.

[Tony T-S]

If you collect post war it's an important cross in the transition to S&L 57er crosses. If you want a TR one then probably not. I'd post this also in the 57er section for more opinions.

[4xL]

Ok, thanks for the opinions but which details would speaks for a
wartime made cross from S&L? Any ideas?

regards 4xL

[Leroy]

It would be nice to see an incused "4" on the pin. Also, it would be nice to have some clarification of a remark made by Paul Preuss, manager at S&L (quoted in the past by Dietrich from an article he had seen) that the company received its last big order from the PKZ, for German Crosses, in July, 1944. Was this the company's first order for DK's? In any case, so far, I would have confidence in the ones marked with a "4" but would have to look very closely in-hand at others. Perhaps Dietrich can comment.

[Tom B]

post war

[Ludwig]

Ok, thanks for the opinions but which details would speaks for a
wartime made cross from S&L? Any ideas?

regards 4xL

None! IMO.