Ek2 with strange construction/ paint

[Snni]

You guys do know that these are a "Myth" don't you ??? These are all fakes made in the 70's ! Spend away boys !!!!! They were not hard to find back then...sold for a couple bucks. I would never buy one one ...I was afraid it would infect my original EK's !

I think you have a thing or two to learn about EK´s!!


This cross are a fine original P&L as the guys said. These are hard to find, so you did good!

[streptile]

Of course Sonny and Ben are correct that the crosses are early, uncommon period one-pieces in zinc.

Tom, do you believe the 1914 versions are fake as well, like this one on a bar?

[Tom B]

I think you have a thing or two to learn about EK´s!!


This cross are a fine original P&L as the guys said. These are hard to find, so you did good!

No they are NOT...I have FORGOTTEN MORE than YOU WILL EVER KNOW about EK"S. You guys do make me laugh , I'll give you that much !

[ben bijker]

Well, basically they are rare, and hard to find.
The people that have replied in this thread are all fanatics when it comes to ek's.

I have read the line " I have forgotten more then you will ever know" too often, and it usually doesn't make sense at all.

I don't know each variation either, but it seems like you have forgotten a lot when you call these P&L crosses fake.

I am not looking for an argument, nor am I trying to insult you, but that's the way it is.

[streptile]

I have FORGOTTEN MORE than YOU WILL EVER KNOW about EK"S. You guys do make me laugh

Hi Tom,

We try to maintain a cordial atmosphere here, and not look down our noses at other collectors too much.

I've noticed that some of the "old guard" collectors -- who collected on instinct and largely in person in the '60s and '70s -- often feel judged or otherwise offended by the newer generation of collectors who use a more scientific approach to collecting. Comparison to catalogue photos, of materials, frames, construction techniques, research into original archival documents, etc., was not the way it was done back in the day, and sometimes new information renders old beliefs obsolete. The "Rounder" RK controversy is just one of the most well-known examples of this phenomenon. Many things long considered original have been unmasked as clever fakes and (less commonly) vice versa. In fact, back in the '60s and '70s, any one-piece EK -- and even any non-magnetic EK! -- was considered a fake. We now know this belief to have been mistaken.

So, really, I don't doubt that these crosses were considered fakes when you were in the heyday of your collecting, Tom. But they are currently accepted as originals. I think the multitude of period fittings, hardware, versions, and finishes presented just in this thread (so far) is adequate testimony to this fact, not to mention the pieces from attributed groupings. If you have some evidence to the contrary, please do present it. In the meantime, I suggest that you take some time to look through some of the older threads in this and other sections to see what has been discovered over the past decade or so. It might surprise you

[ben bijker]

Very well said Trevor!
You are right, although I have to admit that I usually buy by "gut-feeling" instead of studying.
But a bit of help from time to time is more then welcome, I tend to forget a lot as well....

[Tom B]

I doubt it....

Hi Tom,

We try to maintain a cordial atmosphere here, and not look down our noses at other collectors too much.

I've noticed that some of the "old guard" collectors -- who collected on instinct and largely in person in the '60s and '70s -- often feel judged or otherwise offended by the newer generation of collectors who use a more scientific approach to collecting. Comparison to catalogue photos, of materials, frames, construction techniques, research into original archival documents, etc., was not the way it was done back in the day, and sometimes new information renders old beliefs obsolete. The "Rounder" RK controversy is just one of the most well-known examples of this phenomenon. Many things long considered original have been unmasked as clever fakes and (less commonly) vice versa. In fact, back in the '60s and '70s, any one-piece EK -- and even any non-magnetic EK! -- was considered a fake. We now know this belief to have been mistaken.

So, really, I don't doubt that these crosses were considered fakes when you were in the heyday of your collecting, Tom. But they are currently accepted as originals. I think the multitude of period fittings, hardware, versions, and finishes presented just in this thread (so far) is adequate testimony to this fact, not to mention the pieces from attributed groupings. If you have some evidence to the contrary, please do present it. In the meantime, I suggest that you take some time to look through some of the older threads in this and other sections to see what has been discovered over the past decade or so. It might surprise you

I doubt it....I stand on my comments

[ben bijker]

I doubt it....I stand on my comments

It all ends when you're not open to (well-based) opinions.....
Building a collection is learning all the time.
When you think you know it all, it goes wrong......

But that is up to you.

I have some ek's in my collection that I considered fake not too long ago.
In fact, at first I didn't like these P&L crosses a bit, until they started to turn up in untouched groups.....
There are collectors that say: a non-magnetic LdO cross is impossible", yet they are out there from several makers.

Same thing goes for other medals.
Being open-minded gives you the possibility to build a fine collection that is not 100 % textbook but original.

[maurice2396]

Some nice P&L crosses you got there Ben! ! I got a screwback just like yours now I need the pinback ek1. Still searching great examples everyone

[ben bijker]

Maurice, it will come in time.
They are still out there, but you don't see them too often....

[Aiceman]

Thank you gentlemen for this thread,good to read, very good to learn..

[jt327gir]

A good EK collector is one who is willing to learn new information, and keeps an open mind to revise his own knowledge base with the new info he learns from fellow collectors, documentation, etc. I know I'm humbled on a regular basis by the immense reservoir of knowledge I find here and receive from fellow WAF members at shows I attend.

Nobody likes to find out they've been wrong about something they have in their collection, or be told that what they've believed for so long is incorrect. A good collector will swallow his pride, absorb the info, and thank the person who set them straight.

Just my two cents......

[ben bijker]

A good EK collector is one who is willing to learn new information, and keeps an open mind to revise his own knowledge base with the new info he learns from fellow collectors, documentation, etc. I know I'm humbled on a regular basis by the immense reservoir of knowledge I find here and receive from fellow WAF members at shows I attend.

Nobody likes to find out they've been wrong about something they have in their collection, or be told that what they've believed for so long is incorrect. A good collector will swallow his pride, absorb the info, and thank the person who set them straight.

Just my two cents......

Amen to that!
Spot on!

At the moment you stop learning, you start making mistakes

[Snni]

No they are NOT...I have FORGOTTEN MORE than YOU WILL EVER KNOW about EK"S. You guys do make me laugh , I'll give you that much !

All right, it's a fake then..
I would love to buy all the "fake" P&L crosses in the future.. Just send me a PM and I will even pay you 100$ for the 10$ fakes!