French manufacturing ribbon EK2

[Panzertruppen]

Hi guys !

Can you say more on this ribbon of EK2 ? It would french manufacturing and the ring of cross is marked 122 (JJ. Stahl, Strasbourg)

Thank you for help !

[byterock]

Never seen a rosette like that before on a IC ribbon.

Very French style usually meaning a higher level of an award not very Germanic at all.

[Ludwig]

Cute!

[Gew44]

Hi guys !

Can you say more on this ribbon of EK2 ? It would french manufacturing and the ring of cross is marked 122 (JJ. Stahl, Strasbourg)

Thank you for help !

Sorry
but no EKII was made outside Germany or Austria.
The PKN 122 is J.J. Stahl Strassburg --> Austria, near Beck, Assinger & Co.

The ribbon is very cool, not often to see.

Merci beaucop d'avoir mise en public ta Croix.

Regards

[steiner68]

very nice

[Flemming]

Sorry
but no EKII was made outside Germany or Austria.

Except Spain and a very few from Japan

/Flemming

[Gew44]

Except Spain and a very few from Japan

/Flemming

Correct
but that are exceptional production, not a regular production Licensed by PKN.

All official production was made on Germany and Austria, that is more correct because many people confuse Strasbourg (France) with Strassburg (Austria).

Regards

[Panzertruppen]

Thank you !

But it's not my question. I know good this cross comes to Austria (Mea culpa, i wrote "Strassburg" in french version), but my question is on ribbon that is french manufacturing. I want just the informations existing on this ribbon.

Regards.

[Gew44]

This ribbon, IMO, not made for German soldiers, the law about decoration on uniform was known.
Impossible to say if this ribbon was surely made on France or not, but is possible that is an EKII awarded to French Volunteer and him choised particular ribbon for "normal uniform".

Is My personal opinion.

Regards

[streptile]

All official production was made on Germany and Austria, that is more correct because many people confuse Strasbourg (France) with Strassburg (Austria)... is possible that is an EKII awarded to French Volunteer and him choised particular ribbon for "normal uniform".

Hi Gew,

Thank you for both your interesting observations.

Unless I am mis-reading it, I think the button here says "MADE IN FRANCE" (in English), which means this button may have been made for export. Or is there another explanation?

Ie there anything else legible on the button, Panzertruppen? Can you show the reverse of the entire thing please? I never saw an EK2 mouted with a rosette. Very interesting, whatever the explanation is.

So the thread doesn't become useless over time:

[Gew44]

Hello Streptile,
should be understand if the button has been added in this century or later.

"Made in France" does not necessarily mean the product for export before the war; many Germans materials were marked "Made in Germany" and not all ended up abroad, before the war.... after we find the RZM, LDO, ecc. but that are marking mark only for German factorys.

The button marking that was probably standard, regardless of where he was going. Here in Italy it is not difficult to find products "Made in Italy" but are definitely not made specifically for foreign state only to identify the production area and nothing else.

The "rosette" is not only of French decoration also some Italian medals showing the same detail on band, and since about 2000 Italians received the EKII 1939 could be absurd even to that of an Italian military.

And many Italians who were in R.S.I. (Italian Social Republic) to fight alongside the Germans after September 8, 1943 are escaped to France.

So we are dealing with hypotheses.

Vintage photo of the awarded could be definite answer.

Nothing to do with safe or even a professor, just a chat between fellow collectors, are also my personal thoughts to hight voice.

Personally I find it a very special band.

Any other opinion or thought is welcome, I'm here to learn.

A massive thanks

Regards

Gew44

[Edelweiss]

A bit on the late in this thread : an interesting and unusual item to discover, hope some more info about this very kind of rosette will surface one day.

"Made in France" does not necessarily mean the product for export before the war

I would agree with this : a lot of products dedicated to the french market were marked this way. But the quote below confuses me :

All official production was made on Germany and Austria, that is more correct because many people confuse Strasbourg (France) with Strassburg (Austria).

Do you mean that the manufacturer J.J. Stahl wasn't located in Strassburg, Elsass (french province that went back to Germany in 1940), but in Austria ?

[Edelweiss]

Little feedback about this very maker's location, which tends to make me think that the point in question is... obvious ? I browsed the forum and indeed, it is said in another thread that these 122s are "lovely designed cross(es) from a manufacturer out of Austria". No reaction about this affirmation, neither in the present thread (where it's obviously accepted, even by the item's owner), nor in the other (older) one.

Below is a picture of the insigna of the 1st Engineers Regiment (and a close-up of the same MM from another insigna). This unit, the oldest engineer's regiment of the french army, was part of the garrison of Strasbourg (Alsace, France). And the insigna was made by JJ Stahl, in Strasbourg.

Therefore, I'd be very curious to know where the info about JJ Stahl being located in Strassburg, Austria is coming from. Or is it by chance another maker with the very same name in this austrian town too ? And eventually, is the manufacturer Beck, Hassinger & Co (MM 123) also supposed to be located in Austria ?

[hefger]

Hello,

like between 1871 and 1918, Alsace between 1940 and 1944 was an entire part of Germany, the rest of France wasa occupied territory!

Alsace-Moselle (Elsass-Lothringen) was just from one day to the other become a new part of Germany.

So the EK made by makers 122 and 123 in Strasbourg (Strassburg in Elsass) were made in "Germany).

Nothing to do with the Strassburg in Austria!

regards

hefger

[Edelweiss]

So the EK made by makers 122 and 123 [were made] in Strasbourg (Strassburg in Elsass) [...] Nothing to do with the Strassburg in Austria!

Quite obvious indeed, never had the tiniest doubt about that.