Carl Forster & Graf blue package + unmarked cross

[Gabor Tischler]

Hi,

I got my unmarked cross with a Carl Forster & Graf, Schwabish-Gmund blue package, today. I would like to ask your opinions. Is it a real Carl Forster unmarked cross or not?

regards Gabor

[ApathyL]

Latom jo a dolog ;-)

I cannot comment on the maker of the EK, although a nice original one

[Gabor Tischler]

Latom jo a dolog ;-)

I cannot comment on the maker of the EK, although a nice original one

igyekszem

thanks your opinion Les!

[Adrian]

I would suggest that the EK looks very much like a '13' - Gustav Brehmer.

[Gabor Tischler]

I would suggest that the EK looks very much like a '13' - Gustav Brehmer.

thanks Adrian.

regards Gabor

[Robert P.]

I would suggest that the EK looks very much like a '13' - Gustav Brehmer.

Yes, I second that.

[Thomas H]

Well whoever the maker of the cross is, it is not a Carl Forster & Graf. All these Carl Forster & Graf packets are in unused condition. A cross without a packet will in a lot of cases get this packet, so it sells faster.

In the "cases and packets forum" you can find a lot on these Carl Forster & Graf packets.

So your set is a put together, sorry

Kind regards, Thomas

[Gabor Tischler]

Well whoever the maker of the cross is, it is not a Carl Forster & Graf. All these Carl Forster & Graf packets are in unused condition. A cross without a packet will in a lot of cases get this packet, so it sells faster.

In the "cases and packets forum" you can find a lot on these Carl Forster & Graf packets.

So your set is a put together, sorry

Kind regards, Thomas

I will be careful another time with these sets and and let me see in the "cases and packets forum". Many thanks!

regards Gabor

[Adrian]

So your set is a put together

No arguments from me on this, the question is when they were put together.
Evidence from photos showing mass award ceremonies show the officer awarding the crosses being handed the EK from an aide who already has the EKs out of their packets and ribboned up in readyness for the bestowal. This means the EKs were removed from the packets and, we can only assume, the recipients given a packet for their cross afterwards. The crosses and packets may not have been married up correctly in this situation, unless all the EKs came from the same maker which is open to debate of course.
Consequently the sets were potentially 'put together' from the moment they were awarded.
Of course dealers, collectors put sets together but it should not be taken for granted that this is the case everytime.

[Thomas H]

Hi Adrian,

You are totally right in your comment.

I also put crosses and packets together in my collection, but MM on both the packet and cross are the same. Dealer or other collectors did/could also have done this. Like you said it is possible that in the field, the awarded crosses and packet got mixed up after the awarding.

So a set were the MM on cross and packet is not the same could already be together pré 1945.

The Carl Forster & Graf packet are almost all looking unused and are put together by a lot of dealer or private sellers. I still have to see the first set that could be pré 1945.

So it is easy to state/except that almost every (is not all) Carl Forster & Graf set (packet + unmarked or even different MMed cross) is a put together post 1945. I don't remember the date that the hoard of packet came on the market, but all are put together post to that date.

Cheers, Thomas