Ek2002?

[dm5000]

Like Uncle Dan says....

To quote my Uncle Dan who landed on French soil D-day +6. "France would be a wonderful country if it wasnt full of French people."

My apologies in advance...
Dave

[Doug See]

George,
No one can get past the Maginot Line on skates. They will be spotted immediately.....UNLESS they are skating with precision and grace. Then, they will slip by unnoticed and can wreak havoc. All they have to do is carry 2 liter jugs of Coca Cola and plenty of designer jeans with them and they will be able to distract most of the population.

[Eric Stahlhut]

Why is it that many of the threads I read these days invariably turn into a discussion of the Frainch? Things are getting nasty for poor Francois, I fear!
How about we keep these comments on the Kneipe, where they rightfully belong! I know, I know: I may be calling the kettle black.

[Tim Calvert]

Please watch what you say Eric.....

It is politically in-correct to call the kettle black.

[Eric Stahlhut]

Ooooohhhh,
Sorry if I offended your sensibilities in ANY way, Tim! I REALLY am!



Hope all is well,
eric

[James Clark]

Frank,

the article and responding letter appeared in Die Welt on the dates I gave (14 and 20 March respectively). I didn't get this from hearsay, I read both first-hand. I suppose you could address a letter to Herr Martin Homann, CDU-Abgeordnete at the Bundestag if you need documentary proof.

[Dez H]

I think the ban on the public display of the Swastika will remain in Germany for some time. Just look at recent events on Ebay. Certain minority groups are so traumatised by the mere display of a crooked cross. It is well documented by many leading authors that the Swastika has been a symbol of good luck, the sun and prosperity. Used all around the world for thousands of years. I have always wondered why the display of pictures and films of concentration camps, gas chambers and Zkylon-B is not more offensive than the Swastika.

Dez

[George Stimson]

A postcard from a bygone era....



George

[Mike H.]

The sight of the swastika is kinda like assault rifles with pistol grips and flash suppressors, or pistols with high-capacity magazines - the mere sight of them makes honest, law-abiding citizens rampage at McDonald's. Of course, the same weapons minus the offending parts are completely safe and cause no wanton acts. Kinda like (a few years ago) when Winchester came out with Black Talon ammunition. The bullet was designed to spread all the way back to the trailing edge of the slug, causing saw-like serrations that caused "too much" damage. They were banned as dangerous, but all of the other ammunition on the market, is of course, safe.

Why the museums, documentaries, and other sundry affects of the Drittes Reich period are perfectly acceptable, while the hackenkreuz is not, is completely beyond reason.

Of course, I wasn't there then...

[Dez H]

The word "swastika" comes from the Sanskrit svastika - "su" meaning "good," "asti" meaning "to be," and "ka" as a suffix.
During World War I, the swastika could even be found on the shoulder patches of the American 45th Infantry Division.





Dez

[Doug See]

Back to Iron Cross discussion......

Speaking of the Iron Cross (which went through three versions and 126 years before it had the swaz stuck on it)....
It's a shame that the history of the EK seems to have been lost to the younger generations, at least here in the US. My own 19 year old daughter, who supposedly was "taught" world history in public schools, doesn't get it. I have a collection of EK's which consists mainly of 1813, 1870 and 1914 examples, with a sampling of 1939's as examples. I also have a collection of patriotic 1870 and 1914 items which display the iron cross (the original versions, without the swaz), including chinaware, steins, paperweights, etc., all very tasteful and "artistic". I display some of these on a shelf in my dining room (I'm a bachelor and get to do my own interior decorating). One day I came home to find all these items turned around, or placed so that the iron crosses (no swasteeeka's mind you..) weren't showing. My daughter explained that "her friends were over and she didn't want them to think we were Nazi's". What happened to history lessons????

[Mike H.]

Exactly!

Of course, when I was in high school, we got a year and a half of History. Two more in college. World Wars I & II amounted for less than a semester - TOTAL! Basically, it went like this: Germans were upset about a shooting and started a war because they were greedy and wanted more land. Enter the US, who saved the day. A few years later, the Germans were still mad about WWI, so they rounded up alot of Jewish scapegoats and killed them. The German military was really good and began to threaten the US, so we went "Over There" and, of course, saved the day. Boo Germany, yea US!

This is the legacy of our forefathers. On both sides. Thirty-one plus years of history, 10 years of combat, 4+ years of US envolvement, millions of lives, and less than a semester of study...

[Bill M]

--I agree with Rick. The Iron Cross was only instituted for monumental struggles, not for colonial actions or small campaigns. It should be kept that way. Let's hope that the German government never needs to bring it back in the context and spirit in which it was instituted, but to bring it back for any less will tarnish it's legacy.
--Maybe sometime around 2013 or 2014 when they finally get a hankerin` to have East Prussia back

[James Clark]

Er, Germany is part of the international coalition in the global war against terrorism.

How much bigger to you want the conflict to be?

[Daniel Krause]

The discussion about that will never end in Germany.

As we started to get involved at the Balkan our General Inspector told, that it is time for a kind of bravery decoration.......nothing happen
As our pilots did their attacks in the Kosovo war, our minister of defense promised to establish a special decoration to reward special service out there......nothing happen
And now again the same........nothing will happen.

The germans HAD a sense for orders and decorations long time ago. Some funny eyamples:

The Einsatzmedaille der Bundeswehr (Service medal) is given after 30 days of out of area-service with a bar (SFOR, KFOR...whatever.) For every service You can get a new medal. I saw soldiers with 3 or 4 medals. but if You serve more than one time in the same mission You stay with Your first medal, not even an additional bar or a silver or gold class.

To give the Ehrenkreuz as a decoration for merit in foreign service is possible but not at all a good idea. You can not distinguish between "was 10 years in time on his place", "saved the live of an old woman", "was a brave one" Even the class of the Ehrenkreuz says nothing. To the 5th year the Ehrenmedaille is given, to the 10th year the bronze cross, to the 20th year the silver one and after that the golden one. So it is not realy a long service decoration, not really a medal for merit, not at all for bravery.So it is typical Bundeswehr, an EGG-WOOL-MILK-PIG, so it is really time for a new decoration. but.......nothing will happen.

Gtreetings

Daniel