KvK Comparison

[Douglas 5]

Hi :
A question about KvK manufacturing : I noticed after seeing the KVK Panzer Peter had posted that it matches the KvK I have with swords . Does every maker have his own 'Dimple - Pattern' ? I noticed 2 destinct type : A Flowing Pattern and a Splatter Pattern Type of dimple layout ??? The 2 differ by ring mount only . Are the 2 from the same maker ???

Douglas

[Douglas 5]

Pic :

[Robert P.]

Hi :
A question about KvK manufacturing : I noticed after seeing the KVK Panzer Peter had posted that it matches the KvK I have with swords . Does every maker have his own 'Dimple - Pattern' ? I noticed 2 destinct type : A Flowing Pattern and a Splatter Pattern Type of dimple layout ??? The 2 differ by ring mount only . Are the 2 from the same maker ???

Douglas

Douglas,

I can only speak from the (13) KVKII's I own myself. The dimple pattern of each (all by different makers) is different.

[Douglas 5]

Yes Robert , logicaly every maker would have a slightly different pattern , regardles of the pattern type .
The 2 shown here - with the common 'flow pattern' - have absolutly the same dimples in the same shape and in the spot . Meaning they are made from the same die . Do you agree on this ?

Douglas

[George Stimson]

I've noticed War Merit medals by different makers with identical pebbling on the obverses but different lettering on the reverses.

[Douglas 5]

How can this be , George . Are they passing dies around ?

Douglas

[Robert P.]

Yes Robert , logicaly every maker would have a slightly different pattern , regardles of the pattern type .
The 2 shown here - with the common 'flow pattern' - have absolutly the same dimples in the same shape and in the spot . Meaning they are made from the same die . Do you agree on this ?

Douglas

No Douglas,

Looking at mine through a 10X loupe I see the evidence of being produced by more than one die. The layout of the pebbles are not only in different spots, but some are larger in dia., some smaller.

[Douglas 5]

The ones you have may all be from different dies , what I was looking for was confirmation that the 2 I put up are from the same die .

[Douglas 5]

A comparison of the date side shows they match on these ones as well . The arm centers are very distinct with their puffyness . Mine has the same even though the cheap camera does not catch that feature as well as peters camera .
Douglas

[George Stimson]

"How can this be , George . Are they passing dies around ?"

I don't know yet. I'm still looking into it.

[Douglas 5]

The dies are probably mixed pairs and not handed around during the war .
It is more likely a 'post war' thing that has happend . Where some one has gotten ahold of original dies and put a set together ? And then there is a restrike post war with matching original dies possible ... how can one tell ?? A lot of period made unmarked crosses showing up with recent added possible and impossible maker numbers .
As ask on another post ,are certain caracteristics identifyable to one peticular maker ?? Had ask myself this some time ago as I was trying to identify my KVK . They are all so darn close . A collection of dates had reveal to my surprize only 6 quit noticable different ones . Pictures are not always the best - so some or variants possible . Just a short study I never took very far .

Douglas

[Douglas 5]

Now something that is very interest .. but at the same time also scary !!!
The 2 pebbel types on crosses by the same maker one disk back and one pin back - intersting . What is scary is that the maker happens to be the one with the most know fake maker marks : L/12 !! ( The mark authentisty is a seperate subject by itself !) For now assuming they are both original period pieces .
First the most common - here qiut worn die - 'flowing' dimple pattern .
Douglas

[Douglas 5]

And the other L/12 ( Roberts) with the less common 'splatter' pattern :
Douglas

[Montgomery Burns]

maybe the dies are made by a specialised die maker.

ordered by more then one kvk maker to produce.

just an idea from 1914 eara. ( highly discussable )

but just an idea .

regards kay