Still in the Box

[Nigel N]

if you ever get to see and handle a piece from the deschler hoard, you would be left in no doubt about their authenticity

[Adrian]

If evidence and proof were provided,,i might be persuaded otherwise,,
but until then, I tend to believe its a bunch of hype...so many collectors want only "mint" stuff nowadays,,they forget this stuff is 60 to 70 tears old,,,and you are going to sit there and tell me there was a crapload of cased badges stored in ideal conditions,,that just "popped" right out of the woodwork when prices on these,,just happened to be at a premium???

Tim,
I think you're missing the point, the items themselves speak for their own authenticity. I have EKs that came to me loose and were not stored in any perfect conditions yet they still retain 99.9% of their original finish, are these fakes too?
I respect the fact that you are entitled to your own opinion and that you are entitled to voice it, however I feel you should spend a little more time researching these items and make more of a case why you don't believe in these crosses and the hoard and please point out what facts exactly would make these crosses fake as opposed to a 'gut feeling'.

[Bill D.]

I dont believe in the deschler horde or whatever,,I feel someone made up a batch of fakes and now they are in collections everywhere,, do I have proof?? no just a gut feeling after being in this hobby for just a year,,,after what i've seen and heard no way,,, just my 2 cents unless convinced otherwise

A whole year?

Wow.

Well, I'm in my 40th year in this hobby. I can well recall when dealers found it hard to move KvK's. Who wanted them? They weren't combat awards, which is what collectors wanted in 1968.

So, yes, the cache of these crosses was real. The crosses themselves are real.

And your attitude of "I've been a collector for a year, this is my opinion, and it's up to you to change it if you disagree" is not going to get you very far in this hobby, either on a personal level or on a collecting level. You might want to try "I've only been collecting for a year. I don't know a lot, certainly not as much as you guys that have been collecting and studying these badges for decades. But the story really sounds too good to be true. So how can you tell that these are legitimate wartime pieces?"

Unfortunately for this hobby, sometimes it's much more gratifying to start throwing around the "IMHO" abbreviation and issuing challenges.

But I can tell you this: your opinion is very, very humble indeed.

[münster]

Martin,,you nailed it,,,I dont believe in the deschler horde or whatever,,I feel someone made up a batch of fakes and now they are in collections everywhere,, do I have proof?? no just a gut feeling after being in this hobby for just a year,,,after what i've seen and heard no way,,, just my 2 cents unless convinced otherwise

They are real, I know how and seen the pics of it being discovered, these are in no way fake.

[Don D.]

As for things remaining hidden for 60+ years, well, when I was stationed in Germany in the late 70s-early 80s they found 100 tons of mustard gas in an old abandoned factory. I guess losing a crate of KVKs would be even easier.

[Wijtman01]

i own one, bought from dion
but hey dion would you be able to go after those pictures of the discovery
that would be awesome

[münster]

The pics are just as exciting as you imagine.

[bobcam1]

A whole year?

Wow.

Well, I'm in my 40th year in this hobby. I can well recall when dealers found it hard to move KvK's. Who wanted them? They weren't combat awards, which is what collectors wanted in 1968.

So, yes, the cache of these crosses was real. The crosses themselves are real.

And your attitude of "I've been a collector for a year, this is my opinion, and it's up to you to change it if you disagree" is not going to get you very far in this hobby, either on a personal level or on a collecting level. You might want to try "I've only been collecting for a year. I don't know a lot, certainly not as much as you guys that have been collecting and studying these badges for decades. But the story really sounds too good to be true. So how can you tell that these are legitimate wartime pieces?"

Unfortunately for this hobby, sometimes it's much more gratifying to start throwing around the "IMHO" abbreviation and issuing challenges.

But I can tell you this: your opinion is very, very humble indeed.

Perfectly stated.....

[Z19]

60 - 70years old

Just because an item is 60 to 70 years old doesn't mean a whole lot. I promise you there are many square miles of the north african desert that you wouldn't walk through because of the land mines the Germans placed there 60 to 70 years ago and they are still there!!! Just because they are old doesn't mean they won't go BOOM!!
I've seen stuff the last few years I thought I'd never see, but it's still coming out of the woodwork. Bottom line is, this stuff AIN'T RARE....just desirable!!! Alex

[bobcam1]

The pics are just as exciting as you imagine.

I seem to recall from a while back, a website that hosted photos of the discovery.....Does anyone remember it, or have photos to share?

Bob.

[Montgomery Burns]

wel i think its good someone wonderes,,,like niblet

wen i just started i was thinking exakly like that way wen i saw the the first mint.

so much i didnt know back then. (and stupid i was ,,unbelevable)
and aim still stupid most off the thime

atleest he's gonne make so much lovely discovery's gooing along..

in a few jears niblet gonne look back ,,,and maybe only wanting to collect mint.

but as critical as niblet is ,,,its a garantee fore good learning.

to be onnest ,,i have also some doubts.
but maybe without enny reason.
thime wil tell


regards kay

[Gary B]

Martin,,you nailed it,,,I dont believe in the deschler horde or whatever,,I feel someone made up a batch of fakes and now they are in collections everywhere,, do I have proof?? no just a gut feeling after being in this hobby for just a year,,,after what i've seen and heard no way,,, just my 2 cents unless convinced otherwise

Dear Niblet,

I am not sure what proof you would like. If I recall correctly, the horde first made its appearance at one of the German shows a year or so ago. They were found by workers who were doing some building renovations. The lot included alot of KVKs in the "brick of 10", cased KVKs, packeted KVKs and some other ribboned medals. There were also rumours going around that same show that the horde included unissued/mint cased DKiGs as well as some other rare awards, which proved to be false.


As for other finds:

1) 2 years ago a number of ejection molded (numbered 1 thru 4) Assmann badges (GABs) were discovered still in their original paper tissue wrapping.

2) Approximately a decade ago the "26" Russian horde was found which consisted of mint cased EKs that the Russians captured from a German Division's supply area. There were also questions of whether or not other decorations were part of this horde.

3) The T&S Housemaster samples (all of them - 100s and 100s) were discovered in the late 80s/early 90s.

4) In 1993 a friend of mine bought out the US WWII insignia supply (1000s of pieces) from a tailor shop in the Republic of Panama. (I was stationed there and saw the purchase)

These are just a few of the hordes that have come to light within the last decade or so. It is good to question some stories but these are all true stories.

There are many such stories of the "old time dealers" pulling "tons" of items from eastern Europe when the wall fell.

Gary B

[Robert P.]

Robert,,I do respect your opinion, but if the same dies were used to make these would there be any recognizeable diferences? I'm not trying to be smart just having an adult conversation here asking honest questions,,thanks,Tim

Tim,

If you respect my opinion then please respect the opinions of those here who are offering their help to you. Learning is based on keeping an open mind while studying the evidence presented. These are all good guys, and willing to help everyone.

[Wijtman01]

well..... if anyone finds the shots be sure to post them cya

[Nigel N]

well..... if anyone finds the shots be sure to post them cya

would love to see em too, didnt even know there were any photos of the find!!