Juncker bombing

[Don D.]

When did companies switch from tombak to zink? I thought the change was mandated long before Juncker was bombed.

[Robert P.]

When did companies switch from tombak to zink? I thought the change was mandated long before Juncker was bombed.

Don,

This is a good question, and one that I do not really know for certain. Do you suggest that all tombak badge production was shut down before the bombing?

Interestingly I have zinc Juncker badges with the 'SW' siffix, and tombak badges with the 'SW68' suffix. Just a side note.

Edit: Does anyone have this date Don speaks of?

[Robin Lumsden]

When did companies switch from tombak to zink?

1942.

Tombak was still used in the higher grade decorations, of course...........DK etc.

[Robert P.]

1942.

Tombak was still used in the higher grade decorations, of course...........DK etc.

Thank you Robin,

So this changes things. The destruction of the plant, and all that was there could have been the case. Total destruction. Hmmm...

[Matthew]

Cej

Dear Mathew,
here is what I wrote:
I don't see were I said anything about either the content nor the pictures?? I just said I contacted you. Which I certainly did!
Based on the basic human behavior that one gets an answer when one asks politely (which I hopefully did...) I deducted that the site was abandoned. So more so I am now truly surprised to find out that you know about my e-mail, you are even a member here but you never answered my kind request. That I would not have guessed and therefore said 'abandoned"!
So can I ask you again here: may I use one of the pictures for my book?

Seems you believe that sarcasm is the highest form of humour, ok I'll bite..

First things first- Kevin asked if anyone contacted me to FIND OUT WHERE I GOT MY INFO. Well, did you find out where I got my info after contacting me ?

Second, you might have basic human behavior like answering emails downpath but obviously you didnt grow up in the "my word is my bond" neighbourhood.
I was fully prepared to let the whole thing go thats why I edited my last post not to include it but it seems you got really shaken up that someone dared not to answer you polite emails.
Here is why...
I contacted you here (why are you suprised iam a member here then?) about helping me to do a short writeup on EKs and KCs for my website to which you promptly agreed (my word is my bond part). Asked me to include a link to your site to give a proper credit. No problem. You never delivered on that promise. Then out of the blue couple of months later you email me with a favour- to use the pics in your next book.
well, duh, what kind of response (if any) did you expect...

Third -to answer your question about using my materials in your next book- no, find your own.

Hope I adressed your most pressing issues here, if anything is missing do not hesitate to let me know

Back to CEJ now....as far as I know (and someone correct me if Im wrong on this one) the site of the former factory on AlteJacobstrasse 13 is an empty lot and as far as I was able to find out has been since early 50s when the rubble of the former factory was removed. I believe the lot to be a private property. With a bit of legwork Im sure it would be possible to find out who the owner is. If there was anything that got destroyed and lost during the bombing presumably it should still be there. Now I never went metal detecting but (at least for me) that lot would beat say Huertgen forest anytime for that type of hunting. Then again Im sure Im not the first person with this idea so who knows..still- worth the stretch.

Don, to answer your question on the pic above, unfortunately I can not prove beyond any doubt that it is of CEJ factory, by the same token Iam not able to date it, there was nothing on the back, no writing,nothing. If memory serves it was found with another one or two pics and CEJ letterhead. I believe it shows CEJ factory but its just that-my belief.

Iam fortunate enough to being able to correspond with CEJ family members, however slow the process is, there is always some new info included in every mail, for example C.E.Juncker was not even German-he came to Germany from Denmark. Why is still not known and as far as I know the search is on to find out if perhaps he was involved in medal making before moving to Germany. If things go well and I get the permission from family I would like to visit Germany next year and have a good interview as I assume the stories are just fantastic.

As far as my website goes, there is still some material and a few pics waiting to be added to it time permitting. Currently working on a database for pics of original products (product recognition if you will) so if anyone feels so inclined please send them over.

Thank you for your time
cheers
Matt

[Steinar]

perhaps the dies rests in "Teufelsberg" or "Devil's Mountain." just outside of Berlin

read about it here
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,...637505,00.html

[Thomas Durante]

1942.

Robin, do you have documentation to support this? I agree with you that 1942 is the timeframe and is supported by the fact that 99% of all CCCs are made from zink (award instituted in November 1942). But, I have never found an actual document that supports this zink mandate over tombak.

Thanks

Tom

[Robin Lumsden]

Robin, do you have documentation to support this? I agree with you that 1942 is the timeframe and is supported by the fact that 99% of all CCCs are made from zink (award instituted in November 1942). But, I have never found an actual document that supports this zink mandate over tombak.
Thanks
Tom

Hello Tom.
I did see it in black and white somewhere................it must have been in the mid-80s when I was doing a lot of research at the IWM for my writing at that time.
As far as I can recall, it stated that every war badge, cap badge etc. created from the end of 1942 onwards was to be in 'kriegsmetall' as all available copper and brass were needed for the munitions industry.
I should have taken a photocopy

[Dietrich Maerz]

Mathew,

I apologize for not delivering on my positive answer to your request. I surely did not make the connection between your PM here and the website. I'm getting about 10 PM's a day and a lot more e-mails. And I flat out forgot about the article! No excuse however. I apologize again and regret that you did not tell me that I should deliver first so I could have remembered. Only now I made the connection.

Let's move on... I can deliver a good product also w/o the picture.

Dietrich

[tegunn]

Does anybody realize what happens to the surroundings when a 500 or 1000lb bomb explodes on target, much less several bombs? It's not a matter if they(the dies) survived, but of finding them. So, if there is a contempory report of the firm's destruction, the dies were toast..

[Andreas Klein]

1942.

Tombak was still used in the higher grade decorations, of course...........DK etc.

Hello Robin,

The timeline is not that clear. In 1942 it seems they started with the mass production awards to change from tombak to zinc. On higher awards they started later.

For example in 1942 they silver wb was forbidden to produce out if tombak while the gold grade could still produced from tombak.

@Tom
Here is one of the official documents for the war meritt cross and some others.

[Andreas Klein]

Does anybody realize what happens to the surroundings when a 500 or 1000lb bomb explodes on target, much less several bombs? It's not a matter if they(the dies) survived, but of finding them. So, if there is a contempory report of the firm's destruction, the dies were toast..

Glaser & Sohn, Dresden were bombed out too and the factory was totally destroyed. But the dies survived and were found .... they were "destroyed" some days later by the rain because the were very sensitive against rust and couldn't be used anymore.

[Thomas Durante]

Hallo Andreas,

Vielen danke fur posting that, exactly what I was looking for. Was there a date on that document anywhere?

Thanks

Tom

[Andreas Klein]

Hello Tom,

no problem, always a pleasure ... this text is out of a bigger paper clearly dated from 1942. In the WB book we will - with a little bit luck - show the lettering from the PKZ and a WB maker from mid 1942 in which they informed them that the silver WB must be produced out of zinc and that the makers have to change the whole production process.

[Robin Lumsden]

Andreas.

Thanks for posting that document!

It's exactly like the one I saw all those years ago.