I'm sorry to drop a bomb on this sales thread, but this cross is a dead ringer for one I had in my hands not three months ago. Here is the piece in question for review...
Robert
Robert
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Here's my '6' F. Zimm on the left, the copy on the right. Swastika, date, beading is all wrong for a true '6'...
Robert -
looks OK, different cores is not unknown...
anything else different?
regards
jonComment
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Jon,Originally posted by tinmantis View Post
I had one of these copies, and the beading is wider, taller, and does not conform completely to F. Zimm's original frame. Show me another core variant to this maker, and I will think again. But the frame is totally wrong. I had one.
RobertComment
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So that ek2 is 100% fake?Iam Uncle Sam
That’s who Iam
Been hiding out
In a rock and roll bandComment
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I had it in my hand. It is a very good copy of the F. Zimmermann EKII. Until one holds it, etc., it is a very convincing piece. Others have suggested that it may be by another maker altogether. Look at it's frame. It is imitated/copied right down to the inner beading arounds the swastika - but it has slight subtle differences. I call it a fake, a copy of the F. Zimmermann, invented to deceive others into buying one of the TR's most desired EKII's. I had a thread on this piece. I've got to go dig this thread up....Originally posted by münster View Post
RobertComment
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Iam not convinced that is a fake Robert, I think its anouther maker. But to each his own on that piece.Iam Uncle Sam
That’s who Iam
Been hiding out
In a rock and roll bandComment
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And I was under the same impression when one like it came up for sale, and I bought it. After I had it in hand to inspect it, THEN I found out it was only a copy. Each to his own is right....Originally posted by münster;2251187[I
I'm finished, and I'm very sorry to have soured the sales thread. I know it is a copy, that I am sure.
RobertComment
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Hello Robert,
Why do you think the unmarked EK2 is a copy of a F zimmermann in the first place?
You are right that all the details are different from a zimmermann but maybe it was made by a different / unknown maker.
Comment
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The frame on the 'copy' has nearly the exact detailing of the true '6' EKII, only 30% wider, taller. Very good attempt to copy.Originally posted by Ian Lim View PostHello Robert,
Why do you think the unmarked EK2 is a copy of a F zimmermann in the first place?
You are right that all the details are different from a zimmermann but maybe it was made by a different / unknown maker.
RobertComment
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I personally won't have any problems with this type of variant. But everybody has to know on his own how much a piece is worth....
StefComment
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If that cross is a fake, it sure is good! But you never know, those days...Comment
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could it be zimmermann used 2 moulds during the war years?
maybe they made a second mould after the first was worn out or damaged?Comment
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You guys,
No offense to your reasoning, but I held this cheap copy in my hand. One of you should buy this piece and examine it like I did. Your ideas of being a varaint or from another maker would soon vanish. It is just not of Third Reich quality, I guarantee it.
This is the second thread where I've addressed this piece in detail. This is a classic example of how a new piece can, and possibly will, work it's way into our collecting community. Believe me, the quality is just not there on this piece. I had one that was in extremely new condition, like it was made yesterday. Until you hold it you will go on presuming it to be a variant/made by another maker. I'm sorry, guys, this one is just not making it's way into my EK collection. The first ten seconds holding it my gut feeling was - copy.
RobertComment
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Are both these marked '6.' to the ring? (I assume yes if it is being called a Zimmermann)
Any side shots showing seam/finishing? Any traces of frosting front or rear? Is the confirmed Zimmermann frosted chemically or the brused on type? (I don't have one so don't know). Is there any to compare?
Just so I understand, it's being labelled fake because the frame is identical to Zimmermann but core is not...that's all or is there more I'm missing?
This is confusing me...
Swastika, date, beading is all wrong for a true '6'...One saying it's not the same, next saying it is the same but subtle differences.Look at it's frame. It is imitated/copied right down to the inner beading arounds the swastika - but it has slight subtle differences
Perhaps it is a new generation '333/666/999', perhaps not but I think it needs to be analysed more before the sentence is announced?
Bear in mind Maybauer had more than one EK core as does K&Q…
RichComment
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