Gunther Ralls Awards

[Pierre]

I also briefly owned a documented silver Day Fighter Clasp of Rall's...this was 10 years ago. It was different than the one in the more recent auction

considering what Andy says I think that we have here a real problem with the recently Thies auctioned set...


Pierre

[George Stimson]

What kind of documentation did your Clasp have, Andy?

[Luftm40]

It was a signed letter from Rall...I'm pretty darn sure the piece did come from Rall given the circumstances and source (Rather not elaborate). Whether this was his original or some sort of postwar replacement is unknown to me, but that recent auction did cause me to scratch my head. The piece was essentially mint. Many guys received the different clasp grades in very short order given the number of missions they flew, so having unused versions or even multiple version would not be unusual I guess

[George Stimson]

Andy

Thank you!

[Don D.]

I think you could expect most officers to have multiple copies of thier awards. They would have one for daily/combat wear and one for dressing up/walking out chasing the skirts. After all, these weren't controlled items per se. You just had to show proof that you had the right to wear it. Why else was there a private purchase capability?

[StefanK.]

Hi Pierre,


just for your information, the Wurmheller awards that were sold recently were given to his family after his death by his comrades. He never wore them in combat.

Wasn't the "Rall" DKiG that was auctioned a unmarked/marked Godet?

Greetings to France,

Stefan

[Pierre]

Hi Stefan,

Thanks for the informations concerning Wurmheller Stefan. I didn't know that. You are right he german cross in Gold auctioned as Rall's one was a 21 Godet.
Not bad but not as as your attributed 10 rivets. By the way when I visited the Studentenkarzer in Heidelberg in August I have seen the name of the holder's father written on one wall...

Greetings to Austria.

Pierre

[Frank K]

The true warrior does not care about medals and awards... very interesting statement.

On the other hand: "A soldier will fight long and hard for a bit of colored ribbon". Napoleon.

Anyway, interesting info in this thread.

[esquiroz]

Hello,

continuing with Günther Rall's orders, in the english version you can read ..."genuine replacement for the missing decoration..:" but on page 330 ogf the german version he talk about the AUTHORISED VERSION, so as he says, he never got other original period decoration, but the oakleaves with swords. I was in Helsinki by the presentation of his book in May 2006, and he was asked exactly about the destiny of his original orders. The answer was exactly that one on the book, and he also told the history of the only two times in that he used full medals. In my opinion the orders sold by Thies are, may be original, but no the geunine orders of Mr Rall.

regards
Carlos

[Harry]

Thanks Carlos, I figured the translation lost some meaning. Afterall, it is unlikely that anyone would dare wear an award with a swaz on it at the funeral of the former West German prime minister

[Luftm40]

...also guys, it is considered VERY bad form among RKT to sell one's awards. Many quietly do it though. Rall may have just chosen not to elaborate in too much detail about his awards. As Harry correctly states, awards worn by a serving General Officer at a West German state funeral would never have been the versions w/ swastika anyway, he would have sought 57 replacements even if he still owned his wartime versions

[frank savage]

Very, very interesting thread.
Is a pity think that the original Rall decorations, changed hands after the war, have lost its story too. Who knows who are the 'lucky' guy that own an original Rall abzaichen, without knows...
Maybe from today, you'll look at your EKI with other eyes!!!!!!

Cheers, Frank

[Scott C.]

... As Harry correctly states, awards worn by a serving General Officer at a West German state funeral would never have been the versions w/ swastika anyway, he would have sought 57 replacements even if he still owned his wartime versions

I think I read someplace that at RKT reunions, some vets wear their orginal, war-time RK, but turned round so the swastika isn't showing. Could that be the case here?

[frank savage]

Yes Scott, I think that I have read in someplace the same thing too ...

Frank

[Luftm40]

...the more I think about this, the more Rall's comments in the book don't track. The recent auction of his items was in Germany and very public as I remember. I think he would have somehow found out a bogus set of his awards were being offered for auction? Does this mean they were really his? Recently in the US, a duplicate engraved but unissued example of US astronaut Jim Lovell's Space Medal of Honor was offered for sale on Ebay without his knowledge. Lovell found out in very short order and screamed to high heaven about it (rightly so IMO). Also, I would think that even admitting to owning TR era awards would have been a bit controversial for a man of Rall's status in the post war German military...