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**Dave Kane** · 02-05-2006, 11:51 AM

Andre, there's no way not to be redundant but yes, it is a fake as you by now already know!

Credit for bringing this information to the forefront however, isn't limited to the above mentioned but involved several collectors willing to stick w/ an unpopular discussion.

They know who they are

**Ludwig** · 02-06-2006, 01:41 AM

-

Sell it to one of the guys who like rounders. Not me though...

**Dave Kane** · 02-06-2006, 09:41 PM

Dietrich, I just now re-read what you wrote....interesting, to say the least!!!

""Since the time Detlev Niemann, based on the extensive quantity he has handled over the years and thereby not having encountered a Rounder from an original source, has declared them fakes it is a dead issue. There are also other factors that astrongly point in the direction of a post war manufacture, such as Allan's FTIR research.""

What was the defining difference in Allan's (study) as opposed to Tom Hansen's?

**Dietrich Maerz** · 02-07-2006, 08:17 AM

Originally posted by Dave Kane

What was the defining difference in Allan's (study) as opposed to Tom Hansen's?

I find it interesting that you ask this question ....

There are several reasons!

You might recall that Allan was doing his tests about 6-7 weeks before the other test and during that time extensive research was done to find out about the meaning of the tests. Not only did Allan contact some other outfit in England to learn more, we also contacted a University here in Michigan to get another unbiased view. I call this due dilligence and I like to work with material I have access to and I also like to discuss results with the actual testers - which we did.

Based on that unrestricted access to the materials - tests with 3 Rounders not just one - and two more third party opinions, I formed my conclusion. This took about 4-5 weeks to digest.

You will also recall this statement from the former member:

"Regarding results, stick it. When they become available, I will keep the results to myself. Spend the time and money yourselves to evaluate this piece."

Not that there was really a need to 'stick it' ,since Allan took the initiative long before the other former member to conduct tests, but he also made all the results readily available for everybody to see and study (being an owner of the Rounder!). To quote you " a real steward of the hobby" as a lifetime member should be.

I came across another quote from a member here in good standing:

"With Tom refusing to publish his evidence to us after so much posturing esp in light of his indescretion, any credibility he once had about conflict of interest has now evaporated"<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o

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That sums it up pretty good, I think.

So those are the reasons why I base my point of view on Allan's results. I hope that answers the question to you and whoever else wanted to know...

Dietrich

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**Dave Kane** · 02-07-2006, 11:37 AM

Thanks Dietrich but I didn't want to re-hash the animosity, mistakes made, egos and the personalities involved.

I merely wanted to know if the 'end' result / findings were the same

**Dietrich Maerz** · 02-07-2006, 12:54 PM

Originally posted by Dave Kane

Thanks Dietrich but I didn't want to re-hash the animosity, mistakes made, egos and the personalities involved.

I merely wanted to know if the 'end' result / findings were the same

I'd like to quote myself (post #13 this thread):

"There are also other factors that strongly point in the direction of a post war manufacture, such as Allan's FTIR research."

I think that this is a pretty clear statement! Is it the same 'end' result/finding? I don't know, since we had to 'stick it' and I don't care either. I know what I know now and I made everything I know public with the full permission of Allan, all data and all pictures. Everybody can go from there and do his own research, come to his own conclusion.

At this point in time there is no need to discuss this any further, unless you have something new to add.

Dietrich

**Dave Kane** · 02-07-2006, 01:13 PM

Thanks for the very kind and detailed response

**Dietrich Maerz** · 02-07-2006, 01:25 PM

You are more then welcome, Dave

Actually, I appreciated the opportunity to make my point clear again so it doesn't get lost in just one thread.

Dietrich

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