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**Okrach** · 10-30-2005, 06:55 AM

Originally posted by stdub

... you edited your post after I posted my reply ....

That's right - what I wrote there was concerning the FIRST set of pictures - it was not in respect to the scan picture hence was not necessary to leave it here.
Still waiting for Peter's reply - nice scan picture Peter , isn't it? - how the angle and the lighting may influence the judgement...

Debatable cross...

**stdub** · 10-30-2005, 06:57 AM

Here comes a Scan of the rear.

The patina looks like I saw it x-times before on items that were more than 60 years old.

I will not say that this is an original cross (otherwise I would not ask here for), I just can't follow your arguments.

Best wishes

Joerg

Attached Files

KVK-06.jpg (72.2 KB, 88 views)

**Okrach** · 10-30-2005, 06:59 AM

Would it be that the shell is a post war replacement?

I still don't like the patina and the NEW looking screwback set up - opinion comes from the FIRST opicture set

**stdub** · 10-30-2005, 07:04 AM

Peter, so on Kai Winklers Website, No. 10689 is Floch Repro too?

**TerryG** · 10-30-2005, 07:06 AM

Originally posted by Peter Wiking

This is a EK1 reproduction from Floch. Compare the screw disk with the one on your KVK.

Cheers.
Peter

Are you refering only to the small "pimple" in the centre of the shell?

**Peter Wiking** · 10-30-2005, 07:15 AM

I try to gather as many photos as possible of fakes out there. It is difficult to keep track with all junk that is being made or has been made. Restrikes and fakes of Third Reich awards has been made from the end of that conflict and is still being made when i write this.

Here is another photo from the back of a Floch KVK with swords. Compare the outline with your cross.

Cheers.
Peter

Attached Files

fake.jpg (76.1 KB, 87 views)

**Okrach** · 10-30-2005, 07:23 AM

Hi Joerg,

It could be that my first judgement was wrong. I will feel no shame about it - I am here to learn and to exchange the knowledge. I know that there are no collector whose judgement is always right.

After seeing the scan pictures I must admit the front and the reverse look pretty convincing... To be honest I am not sure about this cross any more

Follwing F. Heukemes - trust your instincts - no matter if it is a fake or original I don't feel for it. Let me put it this way - if You ask me if I would have it I would deny. That's it.

**Okrach** · 10-30-2005, 07:24 AM

Hi Peter... same imperfection noticed...

Attached Files

KVK-06.jpg (65.7 KB, 86 views)

**Peter Wiking** · 10-30-2005, 09:44 AM

Here is another photo on a Floch reproduction of the KVK 1 class with swords. It matches the cross in question that started this thread.

Cheers.
Peter

Attached Files

fakefloch.jpg (28.6 KB, 82 views)

**Peter Wiking** · 10-30-2005, 09:59 AM

To support my photo above of the Floch reproduction, here is the back of it with the famous Floch needle and catch. Note the imperfections that can be found on the cross that started this thread.

Cheers.
Peter

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flochcrap.jpg (25.8 KB, 79 views)

**Peter Wiking** · 10-30-2005, 10:12 AM

Peter, so on Kai Winklers Website, No. 10689 is Floch Repro too?

This is the back of the Kai Winkler cross. Compare it with the back of the Floch reproduction. I am not in doubt.

Cheers.
Peter

Attached Files

kaifloch.jpg (44.3 KB, 78 views)

**Okrach** · 10-30-2005, 10:29 AM

Good Job Peter!

After seeing the scans I was nearly convinced it could be real, but my feelings were always negative about this one. Good to know I was not wrong

**stdub** · 10-30-2005, 10:31 AM

Thanks Peter - that was a real good job! I'm glad I can give it back to the seller

Best wishes

Joerg

**George Stimson** · 10-30-2005, 11:03 AM

That was an excellent lesson, Peter! I think that everybody learned from it!

**TerryG** · 10-30-2005, 11:21 AM

Yes great job

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