How does this 1st Class KVK look?

[Mike Dunn]

Thanks for any thoughts! Maker marked on pin L15. Mike

[Mike Dunn]

reverse

here is a scan of the back.

[Dez H]

Hello Mike

You may be interested to do a search for L15 on the forum, these and L15 EKs have been discussed in the past. Personally I don't like this piece at all, the mark is devoid a /, look how the pin is finished at the end, very odd. Hope others can jump in here with more comments. Personally there is so many nice War Merit Crosses around that don't need explaining at all, so I would pass on this one.


Regards
Dez

[Sebastian Bianchi]

Indeed Mike, I would stay clear of the L15 - a known fake has circulated with this number. Do a search and you will find some pictures.

[Mike Dunn]

thanks everyone! Will take a look at the other threads. Mike

[Mike Dunn]

Don't mean to bring up a dead subject, but going through Detlev's site today I noticed a KVK like the one I have posted here with the same maker mark. So--who's on first?? It would seem that maybe this in a good badge. Any new idea's?? Mike

[Dez H]

Hello Mike

First off I would like to say that I respect Detlev's advanced experience and integrity 100%, however the facts still remain that this is a known fake and until someone brings to the table some damming evidence to prove otherwise it shall be always branded as such. There are many variants of pin and hinge in these L15 fakes, which one is the real piece? Who really knows? For this matter we need facts and evidence not just opinions and hearsay information.
I would just like to point out one other point, why delve into these murky waters when there are plenty of textbook, original pieces commonly available? If you really want a War Merit Cross first class, purchase one of the common pieces that need no explaining nor “stories” at all. Just my opinions and observations.


Regards
Dez

[Sebastian Bianchi]

I too saw that KVK, and I contacted Detlev about it. He replied that there were some good ones, but also some fakes ones, and that you could tell them apart if you had them side by side.

I respect Detlev's opinion. That said, in this case, I beg to disagree - I would not want that L15, or any L15, in my collection. There are plenty (and I do mean plenty) of originals to choose from, why bother with a questionable piece?

[Mike Dunn]

The reason I delve into this is because I thought that was what part of the forum was about. I tend to think that Detlev knows a hell of a lot more that most of us. He handles items every day and I am sure he has a large amount of refrence works to back his items up. I just found it interesting to see this pop up.
The piece I asked about was something I was going to resell--I sent it back--Now I would like to know was I correct in returning it because some "experts" here seem to think the badge is bad or was it bad? Tell ya what--in hand--it looked and felt good. Dirty water?? No just wondering--Mike

[Mike Dunn]

Seba--I totally agree with your comments. But, would that not be true with a heck of a lot of the Thrid Riech items. I chose not to sell the badge because there was a question about where or not it was good. I still think that is the main reason for this forum. To point out both sides and go from there. I won't ever sell a L15 badge--period. But???? Mike

[Mike Dunn]

One last thing! DAMN!!! I am glad I collect pre WWII veteran stuff!!!! Mike

[Sebastian Bianchi]

Mike, you seem to be defensive of your posts, did someone say something I missed? Your posts are fine, we are talking about the badge

So anyway, on to your second post - sure, that's true about a lot of pieces, because there are a lot of fakes! There are also a lot of "good" badges out there though, and certainly plenty of good KVKs.

Your point can be taken one step further; a badge I would not touch, someone else will buy. In the end it is a matter of personal choice, and I can only offer my opinion.

[Mike Dunn]

MY last point was not defensive--Just trying to make light of things and that I collect Pre WWII items. Sorry if it came out that way. Mike

[Gordon Williamson]

Personally, I think Mike's piece is OK. L15 marked pieces are always going to be a bit suspect because of Floch's liberal use of that mark, but the finishing on the fakes was never that close to originals in that it lacked the heavy silvering under the matt frosting. I have never seen a Floch piece with the very high burnishing to the edges and to the pin. Also note the oval base area to the hinge and retaining clip, something Ihaven't noticed on any of the fake KVK1's.

Dez makes a good point about shying clear of L15 pieces when there are plenty of good non-contentious KVKs around, it isn't a particularly rare piece, but in this instance, I'd be happy to have this one.

In fact I'll put my money where my mouth is and if Mike is unhappy with it - I will buy it from him.

[Dez H]

Hello all

I would just like to add one further point to this discussion, it has been said many times before however I feel it is important to reiterate. You have to be happy with what you buy. After all it is for yourself and you are the one that has to look at it. One mans junk is another mans treasure, so it is with collecting, just because I like something or you like something doesn’t mean the next person will feel the same way. We all have different tastes, personalities and collecting ideas and interests. As long as you are happy at the end of the day Mike that is all that matters.


Regards
Dez

P.S. Mike sorry if I came over condescending or arrogant, not my intention at all. Just trying to help out.