HG NCO CT and Afrika Officer CT

[RamJet]

New kids on the block.

Enjoy!

[Tim O'Keefe]

Is it possible to get a more clear photo ? The reverse also ?

[RamJet]

Is it possible to get a more clear photo ? The reverse also ?

Yes, in a few months ... when the weather is so that I can do outdoor pics in natural light without flash.

[RamJet]

As promised:

[Antonio Scapini]

Do you have better pictures of both, especially of the back side (where is visible the emboidery)?

To be honest I'm not a fan of them both, IMO the Afrika is not an original.

[RamJet]

I do not see any red flags, but of course I probably haven't handled as much cuff titles as You. My main interest in this field are the GG/HG c/t's.

So here comes the complete photo story.
Front side:

[RamJet]

Back side:

[RamJet]

I forgot to mention: When I obtained the Afrika officer cuff title (over the Militaria E-Stand, by the way) there was a black fabric backing on the reverse of the embroidery which came loose. So I photographed it without this backing. Here is an old pic with the backing in place.

[Tim O'Keefe]

Thanks for the added photos. Agree with Antonio, would pass on each of these.
The lettering looks post war to me.

[RamJet]

The lettering?

[Antonio Scapini]

Digital pictures are terrible.
And from the pictures posted, I'm honest, I can't give you a feedback, since I really don' understand the type of bullion used, the type of base wool...
I can only say I've never seen before an Afrika CT made that way.

[RamJet]

Thank You nevertheless, Antonio.

Perhaps I should give some more info on these bands.

First, both feel right in hand, as they should be. The HG c/t is a very thick wool while the Afrika c/t is much thinner.

The lettering of the HG c/t is correct and the machine embroidery is done with a double thread to thick up the letters as You can see it for example on some GG pre-war c/t's. It resembles the way the hand-embroidered officer HG c/t's from late 1942 onwards look like. As I said, I do not see any red flags or any reasons to mistrust this c/t.

The Afrika c/t embroidery and construction is - as far as I can see - the same like these example at the sites of Weitze (https://www.weitze.net/militaria/28/...l?t=1559746900) and Lakeside Trader (https://www.lakesidetrader.com/item.php?ID=20402). I have pics of a third c/t of that kind, marked "eastside copy protection", but I have no idea where I downloaded them.

The embroidery thread is exactly like on the c/t examples described in the book "Ärmelstreifen / Cuff Titles - Göring Verbände und Fallschirmjäger WK2 / Göring Units and Para Units WW2" from Sascha Ulderup on page 18-21 (L.P.G. GG officers) and page 24 (GG officer, this pictured c/t I also own, You can see it here in this thread on WAF: http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...=849142&page=3, post #39). So I have no objections against this kind of embroidery or construction.

Of course, I haven't had the other two Afrika c/t's I mentioned above in hands. When I am the next time at Weitze, I will take my Afrika c/t with me and compare it directly with the example he is selling.

[RamJet]

Will try to visit Weitze until the end of next week and take a pic of both c/t's.

[Antonio Scapini]

It is years I'm working on a book about cufftitles.
To prove a CT was really made during the TR era we have to start from unquestionable proofs.

It is funny that a such rare cufftitle, as a bullion Afrika one should be, is at this moment for sale from 2 dealers and one is in your hands.

I spent years to find just a handful of original bullion hand made specimens.

I have to be honest: I don't like the bullion used, I don't like the way these Afrika are made, I also don't like the fabrics used. There's nothing that make me think about a wartime production. Furthermore I've never seen before any period picture with such kind of hand made cufftitle in wear.

IMO these Afrika cufftitles are not originals, until proven the contrary.

[RamJet]

The Afrika c/t on the Weitze site stayed there already for a long time.

As I said, the bullion is the same as on other genuine bands.

Of course, all three c/t's could be made using original wartime material by a faker. But also these bands can come from the same taylor find. Wouldn't be the first time.

Don't know. Will keep the c/t as "questionable" in my collection.

Thank You for Your efforts, Antonio.