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    #16
    nice Demjansk shield

    Hello,


    Very nice Demjansk shield Frank , i have a twin brother ( exact match ) for your shield in the collection ( sorry no pictures for the moment ) , mine has however some rust traces on it due to bad storage but i came also directly from the vet ( along with his award documents, wehrpass, soldbuch, picture, awrads, etc ... )

    Mine has the recipients name " Uffz. Pramann " written on the backing paper in ink . THe paper is also smaller then the Heer green cloth, => yours also has probably 4 prongs on the reverse etc ...

    So this is certainly one of the known original variants

    FRiendly Greetings,
    my collectionfield : German glider pilots


    http://users.skynet.be/lw-glider/

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      #17
      Very nice shields guys. If either of you gentlemen get tired of owning one of those, let me know. I'd give it a good home.

      Rayman.

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        #18
        Stijn, the shield is zink and has 4 prongs on the reverse that I can see and feel through the paper. The scan I made really didn't show this very well although it is apparent when you hold the shield. I've always liked this one for the detail, construction, etc. The only thing that's really bothered me is the wonderful shape it is in.
        Richard V

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          #19
          Dear Richard,

          It is very hard to say for sure from your pic of the zinc shield, but you should check into it some more. The repro zinc shield I once bought looked very similar. Four things that make me think it might be one of those:

          -The letter "J" has a serife on top right, which the repro has, my original doesn´t have it. Just an observation, there "might" be originals with that serife, at least my original doesn´t have it and the examples in my books also don´t have it.

          -The cloth on those is generously cut, a bit too broad for my taste

          -The weight is the best giveaway. These zinc fakers are VERY heavy. I am sorry that I cannot offer a weight for my real Demjansk. But if you handled several, it is very obvious without weighing the fake that it is much heavier than originals.

          -The backing paper on those is thicker than you would expect on an original and very rough and a bit brittle on those. It also covers the WHOLE back. It seems yours might be of that kind.

          Cheers, Frank H.
          Last edited by Frank H; 07-20-2002, 06:45 AM.
          Cheers, Frank

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            #20
            Frank thanks for all the information. The shield I have weighs in at 45 grams. The cloth part seems to be larger than that pictured in Detlev's book, so this part may hold true. The paper on the back is not very thick but does seem to be brittle, however it does cover the entire back. I'm now beginning to wonder about this one. Has anyone got a weight, with cloth and backplate to compare to?
            Richard V

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              #21
              Its a fake Richard. I have had one of these as well. 44.8 grams.

              Do you want to see pictures to compare?

              Accidentally offending people on the internet since 1997

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                #22
                Mark, I appreciate the effort but don't think a post of a pic will be necessary. I feel pretty comfortable taking your word for it. Luckily I purchased this in about 1982 so things were still pretty cheap and I am not out a lot of $. Thanks for the feedback.
                Best regards,
                Richard

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                  #23
                  Fantastic! Now we are getting into the "nitty gritty" of these shields. I take it that the weights you guys are discussing refer to the ZINC shields only? I have now found a shield that is 100% from a veteran's lot. It is, I think, a pressed IRON shield(I will verify this). I will post photos shortly. I intend to find out the background of the veteran involved.
                  I have taken note of what you guys have said in previous posts, and this shield doesn't have the flaws you guys have mentioned.
                  ie: The wide eagle chest, the letter "J" has no serife on it, not too much backing cloth etc. Thing is, as I said I think this one is the iron type and you guys have been discussing zin ones. Will find out about the prongs etc.
                  To top things off, the shield is comming from a very, very trustworthy dealer that knows his business really well.

                  Rayman.

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                    #24
                    OK. Just to confuse things. Here is a mint - really mint - Demjansk Shield, which came from the original recipient. He never sewed it to a uniform. It is magnetic and, interestingly, like some of the Krim Shields, has four radial tabs, integrally stamped with the shield and folded over and inwards to secure it to its backing plate, rather than soldered prongs.

                    Prosper Keating
                    Attached Files

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                      #25
                      Reverse of mint Demjansk showing tabs:
                      Attached Files

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                        #26
                        Hello,
                        Just to join Prosper.
                        I've a mint shield too,I bought it about 5 years ago,it was in a group that was split up and belonged to a Oberfahnrich that flew a Junker 52.
                        I couldn't afford more badges at that moment of that group,he had some really nice other badges.
                        The shield is similar to Prosper's,same tabs,iron shield I guess.

                        Jos.
                        Attached Files
                        Last edited by Jos Le Conté; 07-22-2002, 06:25 PM.

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                          #27
                          back.
                          Attached Files

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                            #28
                            Apart from the WH and LW backing cloth, your shield is identical to mine. As I have sometimes said, I do not go out of my way to acquire mint pieces as I prefer medals and badges that were supposed to be worn everyday not to be mint and unused but when mint pieces happen to come along, it is always interesting to see how something looked when it was brand new.

                            PK

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