One For Pascal - Krim Shield - Please take a look

[TobyR]

Hi Everybody,

Here's the latest Krim to wash ashore here. One to keep? Or should I throw it back in the sea?

As you can see from the pics it would appear to be buntmetall: if you look at the eagle's talons you can see where the plating has rubbed.

I look forward to your thoughts on this one.

I haven't posted a shot of the back since it is covered in cloth.

Thanks and all the best,
Toby.

[TobyR]

And some close-ups:

[TobyR]

Crimea:

[Pascal H.]

Dear Toby,
This is an original Krim shield which washed ashore to your beautiful island. According to some this type of shield has been made by Friedrich Orth although there is no proof of that so far.
The shield you posted shows all the characteristics of a Friedrich Orth shield but lacks some of the finer details so I suppose this is a heavily worn shield.

I would however be very interested to know if this shield has tabs or prongs on the back. They normally have prongs on the back with some very typical backing paper but very occasionally (so I suppose very rare) you can find them with tabs. There should however no cloth covering the back.

Anyway congrats with this shield, very nice.

KR
Pascal

[Pascal H.]

Just had a closer look and your shield is really missing a lot of detail. I still think it is an original shield but maybe one at the end of the production run.

KR
Pascal

[TobyR]

Hi Pascal,

Thank you very much for replying. I'm glad to hear your thoughts are positive.

Re. the question of prongs or tabs, I believe this one has prongs though this is based on feel rather than sight.

Do you have a picture of an FO to compare?

Best regards,
Toby.

[Pascal H.]

I wish I could you show you my own example but mine is still in the post and should arrive tomorrow .

Allan has a very nice example and I hope he won't object for me posting his shield here.

KR
Pascal

[Pascal H.]

Here the reverse with the typical backing paper.

[Pascal H.]

This part is the part which I think is a bit worrying with your shield. See the lack of detail on yours. Allan is on the left, yours on the right.

KR
Pascal

[Frank Heukemes]

Dear Pascal & Toby,

Frankly, I do not believe this is one of the shields shown by Pascal. It looks odd and too different. The eagle head is very characteristic for the so called Friedrich orth shields and Toby´s does not match these characteristics. A view from the reverse would indeed be interesting. Toby´s shield seems to have tabs, not prongs.

[Patrick W]

Absolutely not the same shield, I think Pascal's comparison shows that very clearly- not from the same die. Lower left you can see where one of the tabs is bent back. The wear looks honest so IMO late quality original shield. There are much nicer ones out there though.

[Pascal H.]

I had a good close look of Toby’s shield and an original FO shield and I agree there are a lot of differences but also a lot of similarities.

There are too many differences between the shields that the two shown shields can’t be from the same die. At first I thought that Toby’s shield was a much worn late production FO shield but I have now seen some differences that have nothing to do with wear.

So would it be right to assume that Toby’s shield is a copy of a FO shield and therefore a fake? I don’t know of any other know original which comes that close to a FO.

As for the tabs that would be indeed interesting but there are original FO examples known with tabs.

KR
Pascal

[Frank Heukemes]

Maybe the reverse will help us.

[TobyR]

Pascal, Frank,

I'm beginning to think this is a fake. I've managed to gently separate the backing cloth (I'll take a photo tomorrow): the backing plate has no prongs coming through it, and there are no tabs visible. Glue (like modelling glue) was used to stick the two pieces of cloth together.

Thanks for your time.

All the best,
Toby.

[Pascal H.]

the backing plate has no prongs coming through it, and there are no tabs visible................

That is very strange, no prongs and no tabs??????????

Anyway, the backing plate of a Krim shield should be covered by paper. I don't know of any original Krim shield of were the backing plate is covered by cloth.
So that is a bad sign.

I tend to agree with you here Toby. There are too many differences between this shield and a original FO shield. To me it is quite clearly that this shield is a copy of a FO shield and a good one as it fooled me in the beginning as well. There are however too many differences which can't be explained by wear only.

I think you will do well by letting this one go. As Patrick already said even if this one is right (which I now highly doubt) there are much nicer ones out there. A real so called FO type is a very nice one. I hope I can show you my own one, one of these days.

It would be interested to see the back of this shield.

KR
Pascal