Opinion on Demjansk shield

[Pascal H.]

New member Duzig would like yo hear your opinion on this Demjansk shield.
Thanks!!

KR
Pascal

Hello,
I also have one of these shields that I bought years ago from a "well respected" dealer/collector but I have been told that it is a repro. Mine is also of zinc but on mine the j is different. I don't have the ability to post a pic of mine but if someone would be willing to post it for me I would send them a pic, if not could someone tell me what the differences are between a real zinc one and a fake zinc one would be. If I"m not mistaken I have heard some people say that all zinc ones are bogus which apparently is not true. I don't collect combat awards per se, just happened to pick this one up years ago before I really started collecting stuff. Thanks for any help or info
Duzig(Bill)

[Pascal H.]

Reverse

[Pascal H.]

Hi Bill,
Ok, so let me be the one with the bad news.
This shield is not an original shield. This is the most encountered fake.
This fake is often revered to as the fake with the serif “J” and moving prop.

A search on the forum will reveal a lot of these fakes.

KR
Pascal

[Duzig]

Hello,
Pascal,thanks for your info. I'm surprised somewhat,being that the detail on this one seems much better than the originals apparently. And any idea when these started popping up or, if the serif on the j is the only reason why these are considered repros? Now the moving prop,that is found on originals also or no? Again in any case I thank you for your help and info.
Bill

[Duzig]

Hello,
Pascal, thanks for your help and info. Am somewhat suprised being that the detail seems better on this fake apparently compared to the one shown in the other thread...but this is part of the reason why I don't collect combat awards ,to hard to distinguish fakes. Any idea when these started showing up? and is the serif on the j the only reason these are considered repros? Also the moving prop,these are seen or originals also or not? In any case I thank you again for your help and information
Bill

[Thomas Bendixen]

Pascal is right - known dangerous fake

Cheers Thomas

[Duzig]

Hello again all,
Don't know why my post came up twice,sorry about that. Thomas I thank you also for your reply to my question. As I said I don't really collect combat type awards so I appreciate your help.
Bill

[Killerbee]

Hello,
Pascal, thanks for your help and info. Am somewhat suprised being that the detail seems better on this fake apparently compared to the one shown in the other thread...but this is part of the reason why I don't collect combat awards ,to hard to distinguish fakes. Any idea when these started showing up? and is the serif on the j the only reason these are considered repros? Also the moving prop,these are seen or originals also or not? In any case I thank you again for your help and information
Bill

Old thread, but any good response to the above question?

I'm far from being an expert on these Demjansk shields but from all the threads I've read on the forum regarding these shields, their doesn't seems to be any "true" authority either way. If I recall, the "book with some authority" (can't remember the name) which was referenced in one of the numerous threads, was shot down. Moving props vs no moving props... someone mentioned "serif J" are good on zinc shield... if they really exist but not on metal. Also, some of the shields that were given the thumbs up seem less detailed than the "fake" ones and some of the stated originals seem to have a very very slight "serif J" and some seem to have "slight" moving props. All this is very confusing. I know Pascal is the best expert from the threads I read and he mentioned that he has good examples that can be taken back to an original source (which is great), but "all" the fakes that we call fake, can they be taken back to an original reproduction factory? And do we have 100% provendance on that fact? Also, what is more confusing is if I were a reproduction company, why wouldn't they make an exact copy? Or is it possible that the "serif J" is Ok and based on an original and because we know that the repro company is using as a basis, then we conclude that all "serif J" or "moving props" are bad. I'm sooooo confused. Something just doesn't seem right. And it seems to me that my confusion abounds for many others collectors regarding these shields.

One thread mentioned that in the last three years much new info has come out and thus changed opinions on these shields. I assume it also could change again and we maybe back to square one. Will we be back to find that the "serif J" of "moving prop" were based on an original shield and thus a good design? And then we will back analyzing the material and age and quality? But as of now, the "serif J" and "moving prop" opinion has greatly influenced me and anytime I see that or any hint of it, I almost immediately conclude to reproduction.

I apologize to the experts regarding my ignorance on the subject but I need help... please please help me Is there a good book out there that I can read.... has Pascal published one yet?

Anyway thanks for the help ahead of time.

Regards,

Jim