something you dont see all the time....

[Mark S.]

Just thought I would share some pics of a cloth EK I in wear. Not exactly something you see every day...
As always, comments welcome.

[Jos L C]

Lovely picture,Mr.Schroeder,
I'm always in for that kind of odd pictures.
I've seen a same sort of picture from a
Stabarzt of the luftwaffe who had a cloth
EK-1 of which the black part was of iron.
Very special!
Thank for sharing it!
Regards!

[Dave Suter]

I'd have probably said something stupid, like "They never wore cloth Iron Crosses." Thanks for sharing. That is one nice photo. NEVER say never.

[W. C. Stump]

Gentlemen:

The fakers are hot at work on the Cloth Bullion Iron Cross 1st Class. A friend of mine gave me one as a present and he thought it was real. If any one wants to see a scan, let me know and I'll let Mark or Kevin post the obverse and reverse.

W. C. Stump

[Bruce Simcox]

Hi Bill,

This here thread would be as good a spot as any to post the scans of the FAKE bullion EK1.

--------------------

Bruce

[W. C. Stump]

Bruce:

I can provide the item, but have not learned to post pictures. I haven't hears from anyone saying that they will post same. I will get the scans ready and will provide same upon demand.

Bill

[Bruce Simcox]

Hi Bill,

If you can send the scans to me, I would be happy to post them for you. I have updated my profile to receive private messages.

--------------------

Bruce

[Sebastian Bianchi]

Mark, is that a private picuture or from a book?

Seba

[Rick Research]

The cloth EKI in the photo above appears to be the 1939 type. For a photo of a 1914 EKI, see entry for Generalleutnant Franz Mu"ller-Michels in K. F. Hildebrand's "Die General der Deutschen Luftwaffe 1935-1945," volume 2.

Bizarrely, Mu"ller-Michels is not wearing a Fliegerbluse, as above, but the "dicke Hermann" double breasted tunic with white overcoat style lapels. Since he made his rank in 1937, and transferred to the Luftschutz in June 1939, this would APPEAR to indicate pre-WW2 usage (so PRE-German Cross analogy).

I'm not aware of ANY authorization for this peculiar style of EKI, but obviously types from BOTH wars were worn.

[Mark S.]

I should have made mention before: the picture is courtesy of our esteemed colleague Francois Saez.

[Bill W.]

Will everybody please take another look at the photo and attempt to answer these observations (questions) I have.
1) why is the cross so much more pronounced
2) why is the shape so distorted
3) can things be enhanced via computer....
heck, it looks "painted on".
Bill

[Jeff S]

Bill, I had the same thought when I first looked at the photo. I've seen plenty of touched up photos(yes, great majority done during or immediately after the war), and I initially thought that the white outline was drawn on. Especially comparing it to other items with white "thread" next to it.
However after looking at more closely I believe it to be just what it appears to be. Notice that immediately above and below the cross are folds in the cloth. Something is obviously there. I don't see much of a reason someone would add a EKI to the photo of a man, that clearly would have already been wearing one.

Just my .02

I am glad to see that I'm not the only skeptic here!

[Panzer]

Hi guys,
that was my immediate thought too, especially as it was so bold. But when you look at it, there is no explaining a gap where it is, it has a small ridge-line running around the frame border (not likely to be put in by a retoucher) and it sits just the way it would if sewn down.

Basically this looks like a field made item to me, rather than a purchased item from a manufacturer. Thus the slightly crude look.
Just my two cents worth. Cheers, Wade.

[Bruce Simcox]

Here are the scans of the repro EK1 that I am posting for Mr. W.C. Stump:




As was mentioned above this is a newer repro that was given to Bill by a friend.

-------------------

Bruce

[ 19 June 2001: Message edited by: ssimcox ]

[Prosper Keating]

That is a tragically bad cloth EK1! Nothing like the real thing. Even the cloth EK1s made in the UK 20-odd years ago for a certain top end London dealer by an embroiderer at the firm of Israel M Hand near Piccadilly Circus were better than that. And they were let down by the use of twisted beading of a typically British rather than European type. I have some pictures of one of these fakes somewhere which I will post later wheen I have time. If anyone is interested.

Prosper Keating