S&L Production Periods and Terminology

[Nigel N]

Hi Guys!
Following an interesting discussion in another thread, I think this subject deserves a thread of its own?
So.......
In your opinion, what terminology would be best applied to S&L's various period's of production??
Name as many period's as you think are needed to separate the various hardware types, production methods etc.
For example, if you think "very early" best describes the period 57 to 60, early for 60 to 62 mid...... etc. etc.
Remember S&L have been in (to the best of our knowledge) constant 57 production for well over 50 years!!
I look forward to hearing your thoughts, and no worries if we don't all agree!!
-Nigel

[Norm F]

Well, I'll kick things off by re-posting this starting point from the previous thread:

"Very early", 1957-1960: round-wire main pin, solid block hinge, narrow flat-wire catch

"Early", 1960-1963: narrow-topped main pin, solid block hinge, narrow flat-wire catch

"Early to Mid" (transitional), 1963-1965: narrow-topped or wide-topped main pin, solid block hinge, double-wire catch, +/- dome head hinge pin

"Mid", 1965-1968: wide-topped main pin, solid block hinge, narrow flat-wire catch, +/- dome head hinge pin

"Late", 1968-1970's: wide-topped main pin, hollow hinge, wide flat-wire catch, +/- dome head hinge pin

Here's an illustration of these categories as well as an additional composite of the various awards that comprise the unique "Early-Mid" category with their double catch.

Best regards,
---Norm

[xmember]

I absolutely agree with the terminology listed which is what I have been using since I first started collecting and was widely understood.

Regards,
Rudy

[Skyhawk]

Hi All,

I agree with the below as well, and the images are very helpful!

Maybe there could be some discussion with what do with the period after "late". Does "modern" suffice? This is about a 34 year period at this point, and covers more years than 23 years from very early through late.

S&L definitely has staying power!

Best,

Jeff

[Brig]

I like Norm's thorough examples...maybe we should pin this thread

[Nigel N]

Here's a similar discussion thread from a few years ago.................
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=441897

-Nigel

[Skyhawk]

Hi Nigel,

Interesting thread from 4 years ago! Looks like the terminology/timeline was pretty close to what is being proposed now. Hopefully, this time a consensus can be reached and a good, pin worthy reference thread created with examples.

I wonder if Rudiger is still a very early production??

Best,

Jeff

[Norm F]

Thanks Nigel. It's interesting to see the evolution in thought over the years.

I echo Jeff's question about how to divide the "Late" category -- where to put the line between late and modern. In that previous thread, Rüdiger suggested from 1976 to the 80's was "modern". Does that still apply?

Also, on the earlier side of the spectrum I just noticed this GAB100 which seems to fit the "early" category but has a dome-head hinge pin. Likewise this IAB. So should we add "+/- dome head hinge pin" to the description of the "early" category?

Best regards,
---Norm

[Nigel N]

Yes, that was an interesting discussion, but unfortunately it petered out without reaching a conclusion!
I do think the huge span of time between 1970 and current production is too big to be covered by just one category?
From what I have seen, there isnt a huge difference between the first open hingeblock pieces @68 to pretty much the end of the 70's, the sandblasted frames and cores painted after assembly could be the start of modern production?
@Norm, I will have to check again re the double catch and the round headed hingepin, off the top of my head I can't remember what the earliest or latest pieces with these features we have seen are!!!
-Nigel

[vic007]

Hello

Interesting thread.
I agree with the view of Norm.

It would be great if you could find some subcategories for the '70s badges, Nigel.
Looking forward reading your findings.

Best regards


stijn

[Skyhawk]

One other thing I would like to add since we are dealing with all S&L produced pin back pieces. The very early DK,EK1, and spanges can be found with the TR era style wide pin. Some marked with the "4". I am not sure if this pin type was used on a badge other than the wound badge?

Best,

Jeff

[Brig]

What's a dome head hinge?

[Norm F]

What's a dome head hinge?

Hi Brig,

These are dome head hinge pins on the S&L 57s. (They're quite different from dome head hinge pins seen on wartime badges.)

Best regards,
---Norm

[Norm F]

Latest version to work on further:

"Very early", 1957-1960: round-wire main pin (on most war badges and wound badges) or wartime wide pin (on DK, EK1, Spanges), solid block hinge, narrow flat-wire catch

"Early", 1960-1963: narrow-topped main pin, solid block hinge, narrow flat-wire catch, +/- dome head hinge pin

"Early to Mid" (transitional), 1963-1965: narrow-topped or wide-topped main pin, solid block hinge, double-wire catch, +/- dome head hinge pin

"Mid", 1965-1968: wide-topped main pin, solid block hinge, narrow flat-wire catch, +/- dome head hinge pin

"Late", 1968-1980: wide-topped main pin, hollow hinge, wide flat-wire catch, +/- dome head hinge pin

"Modern", 1980-

Best regards,
---Norm

[Brig]

Hi Brig,

These are dome head hinge pins on the S&L 57s. (They're quite different from dome head hinge pins seen on wartime badges.)

Best regards,
---Norm

ahhh....thanks