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    #31
    Originally posted by foghorn View Post
    these threads are really great the amount of knowlegde that is coming out of them is outstanding. i think what we need the most is a bloke who worked at S&L during 30 or so years from the 50s to 80s now that would help

    best regards
    tom
    Oh if only!!!!!! Imagine sittng down for a few beers with a guy like that, what stories he could tell us!!!
    -Nigeldrinks.gif
    sigpic 57ers...."The Devil Is In The Detail"

    Comment

      #32
      Originally posted by foghorn View Post
      these threads are really great the amount of knowlegde that is coming out of them is outstanding. i think what we need the most is a bloke who worked at S&L during 30 or so years from the 50s to 80s now that would help

      best regards
      tom
      I wished that the old employers could help!!!
      With some six packs

      Although I regret that I answered my thoughts about the production date of Assmanns, I am happy that a few members are open minded again
      I also shoot in the dark here and I maybe have a little more information to build on, but like I said, I can be wrong.


      I hope to see some other S&L's with the same eagles as the Assmanns to see if they are indeed used from the same period a S&L used wide catches and open hinges!
      I would als like to see other S&L's/Deumers with the same wreaths used on the Assmanns.

      One of the things that make me believe that the Assmann observers are of early manufactoring are the wreaths.
      Take a look at the "uncommon" Assmann observer and compare that wreath with the same wreath as the S&L airgunner with thick needle being IMO one of the earliest S&L's. The Assmann wreath is IMO more crisp and possible struck earlier. (was the wreath bought from S&L or did S&L buy the wreath from Assmann?)
      It is IMO unlogical to see a wreath from the fifties being used by another hersteller as Assmann in the seventies while S&L was still making 57's!

      Also look at the comparisson with the late FJ badge.
      The wreath looks to be made from the same die to me but the wreath is MUCH lest detailed.
      Did S&L use the old Assmann die?

      So I hope to see more of these wreaths as used on the Assmanns and see what happend in comparisson with the period of S&L's where we have a little more information.
      Last edited by LuckyLuudje; 06-15-2012, 03:38 PM.

      Comment

        #33
        Hi Luud, never regret your thoughts buddy, if thats what you think, stick with it!!!
        I only have the EK1 in my collection thats an Assmann, you have many more Assmann pieces than i have!!
        It could be that what happened with the EK1's did'nt happen with other pieces, as i said in another thread, the whole 57 story is a voyage of discovery, lets see where it takes us!!
        -Nigel
        sigpic 57ers...."The Devil Is In The Detail"

        Comment

          #34
          Luud your thoughts and opinions are always good i have no assmans (yet) so as far as i gather im neutral and i think your all right
          and as to that 6pack i wouldn't mind some of that

          best regards
          tom

          ps good quote
          Errors of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it.
          by thomas jefferson see theres another tom

          Comment

            #35
            Hi Luud,

            Thanks for your hard work. This is very valuable to me. It will take me a while to soak all this in but your input and knowledge is much appreciative. I'm sure I will utilize this thread for years to come.

            Now what's this with my name being used with confusion. It's bad enough as it is now.

            Regards
            Rudy

            Comment

              #36
              Thanks Rudy, that was the main purpose of this thread.

              Originally posted by Nigel N View Post
              Hi Luud, never regret your thoughts buddy, if thats what you think, stick with it!!!
              I will stick with them as long as someone proves me wrong.
              Seriously, I only hope some more information will shed some more light in the dark and if I am wrong, I will be the first to admit.

              I do like the quote posted by Tom from Tom, but we don't combat here.
              Nigel, Rudiger and I may differ from opinion this time, but we do respect each other

              I am still searching for the discussion thread that where you guys came up with the idea that Assmanns are made in a late period because IMO it doesn't make sence at all......maybe than we can combat like Tom says because I have some ammo that I held back

              Comment

                #37
                Originally posted by LuckyLuudje View Post
                maybe than we can combat like Tom says because I have some ammo that I held back
                watch out lads hes got a assman airgunner

                best regards
                tom

                Comment

                  #38
                  Originally posted by Tom C. View Post
                  watch out lads hes got a assman airgunner

                  best regards
                  tom
                  Be aware or you need an Assmann Wound Badge


                  I just posted the Assmann Gliders here:
                  http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=603728

                  Comment

                    #39
                    Originally posted by LuckyLuudje View Post
                    Be aware or you need an Assmann Wound Badge


                    I just posted the Assmann Gliders here:
                    http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=603728
                    would that be the black, silver or gold

                    your gliders are fantastic by the way

                    Comment

                      #40
                      a theory

                      on assman medals:
                      if you look at assman medals of the TR period the pin and hingeblock look almot identical to that of the early S&l badges whereas the S&L Tr period looked similar but where wider.
                      the theory is that assman came out with later designs for the pins which were more cost effective which S&L then copied at a much later date (probaly when assman went bust).

                      timeline:

                      TR assman thin needle and hingeblock
                      Tr S&L thin needle but wider hingeblock
                      57er 50s assman (bit unknown) possibly the open hingeblock!
                      57er 50s S&L copyed assmans ww2 pin design saving medal and materials on the width
                      57er 60s assman by now definatly had the open hingeblock
                      57er 60s S&L upgraded their design to the solid hingeblock and wrap around pin
                      57er assman late 60s early 70s assman i belive went bust then
                      57er S&L late 60s mid 70s like after ww2 grabbed dies and machines and started producing assman pins and blocks

                      so how does that sound to you guys this is really based solely on lw badges whats your thoughts

                      best regards
                      tom

                      Comment

                        #41
                        Hi Tom!!
                        Some great thoughts in there, a lot of what you said may well be true, or pretty close, its difficult to say for sure on some of the points you made, but i know that, even as we speak, great minds are at work to solve the puzzle!!
                        Only thing i'm not so sure on, is how long Assmann went on producing?? I have a feeling they ceased production earlier than a lot of people think, the quality IMO is just too good for later pieces???
                        I'm sure there will be new threads to come on this subject!!!
                        -Nigel
                        sigpic 57ers...."The Devil Is In The Detail"

                        Comment

                          #42
                          I appreciate your efforts Tom. As Nigel states, there are some activities going on to help date Assman's accurately. More to follow...

                          I've said previously and will say again, that it's necessary to switch off the habit of dating primarily by hardware when considering Assman produced pieces. It's not even good to do that with any maker, but it's especially true with Assman.

                          Based on finish, strike characteristics, number of pieces produced, etc. my own opinion is that their production run was relatively short and was early, likely very early on.

                          Time and study will teach us what we need to know considering Assman pieces.

                          Comment

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