Glider from David

[Mike Yokum]

Here is one of the two items I was fortunate to pick up from David's sale. Cheers buddy!

I look forward to hearing where each of you places this piece in the "very early-modern crap" timeline. No matter where it fits I feel quite fortunate to have added it.

Note the wreath is a seldom seen type. S&L? Another hersteller altogether? The last two pictures are a comparison between my first Glider with typical S&L characteristics and this newly acquired badge. The eagle on the new badge is much thicker and the wreath on the badge on the left is much like the wartime wreath in shape and design. It may be from a reworked wartime die?

[Mike Yokum]

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[Mike Yokum]

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[Mike Yokum]

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[Nigel N]

First of all Mike, i've got to say what a great looking Glider badge!!!
The wreath is, as you say totally different to your other Glider badge, which has the more commonly found thin wreath!! I'm sure i've seen that wreath before, either on a different qualification bdage, or a wartime variant, i just can't remember!!
The eagle too looks to have differences, though not as different as the wreath!!
As for date, well if it is S & L, we have a few things to go on, the thicker later style of catch, the pin style, and maybe most important, the open hingeblock.
I'm not sure if war/qualification badges changed their hardware at the same time as EK's or not, but the open hingeblock was'nt used before about 1967/68 on EK1's!!
But the overall quality look of the badge makes me think its a bit earlier??
Whatever, its a beauty!!!!!!
-Nigel

[DavidM]

Hello Mike

Glad to see that the package with the two badges arrived safely.

I initially thought that this one was from either the very late part of the early manufacturing period, or maybe the very, very early part of the mid period. However, I feel that it could well be an early one, but not from S&L. Who it's by I've never been certain. An Assmann perhaps? A Deumer? A Souval? Either way it will should keep you occupied trying to match it to a maker, even maybe a wartime one.

Enjoy it

Regards
David

[Nigel N]

I think David could be onto something!!
Just thinking about EK's.......
Whats early, quality, but has an open hinge block, and thick catch???
Answer......Assmann!!!
Heres the reverse of my Assmann, does the hardware look similar when compared to your Glider badge Mike???
I can post some closeups of hinge/hingeblock & catch if it will help??
-Nigelmedals%20021.jpg

1%200341.jpg

[DavidM]

That EKs rear setup certainly has similarities to the Gliders.

Regards
David

[Mike Yokum]

Thanks for the input gents!

Something that does not show well in the pictures already posted is both the pebbling on the wreath oaks and the matted finish on the wreath. It is not like any S&L piece I've seen before. David, I think you are correct in stating that this piece is likely from a maker other than S&L. And Nigel does make a compelling case for Assman as the hardware is quite similar, particularly the shape of the pin.

Here is a photo of an Assman mm'd piece from my files. While the wreath and rivets are different the finish and hardware are almost identical. Assman also used open hinge blocks on even their early pieces. Your thoughts?

[Nigel N]

Hi Mike, I think Assmann is a strong contender for your Glider badge, they have used a different wreath, but the hardware looks very, very similar, as does the eagle!!
If it is an Assmann, than it is a real rarity, they only seemed to make very small numbers of each award they produced!! Combined with that wreath you could even have a unique piece!!00hour.gif
I think its really special Mike, congrats!!!!
-Nigel

[LuckyLuudje]

Here is a photo of an Assman mm'd piece from my files. ... Your thoughts?

My thoughts are mainly that I find it annoying that I see so many pictures of my items being posted by others (mostly on an other Fora).
I also doubt that my Assmann will add something to the discussion.

As I already told to you before: I think that your glider has been made by S&L in the mid sixties.

It has the rivits and hardware that I have on some "presumed" S&L badges.
I am not an Amember anymore, so I can't post pictures anymore.
But If you search for "PAB 100", you will find one of these badges from me wich are IMO made in the same period as your glider.

The wreath is IMO also a S&L wreath.
It is the same wreath as my Heeres FJ badge (of wich you my pictures also) wich has all the charateristics what I look for in a S&L badge and came in a large group wich contains badges and crosses that are all attributed to S&L.
Although the pictures aren't sharp enough to make a good judgement, the eagle on your new glider looks less crisp than the early gliders that I am aware off.

My heeres FJ badge has the solid hinge and smaller catch, but has a wreath wich looks as crisp as your wreath.
I rarely saw this same wreath, so probably used it for a short term.
This is one of the indicators that makes me believe that yours could be one of the first S&L badges with this "presumed" later hardware.

Just my 2 cents.

[LuckyLuudje]

Here is my PAB 100 posted:
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...hlight=pab+100

It has the finish wich is different compared to the early S&L's.
But also completely different compared to the early Assmanns.

[Mike Yokum]

Luud,

Let me apologize again, this time publicly for unintentionally using your picture. Had I known it was yours I would not have used it. We have shared hundreds of pictures back and forth in the last year and this was an innocent mistake. Peter can remove the picture upon request. Simply ask him to remove it and it will go away.

I do remember you saying you felt the glider from David was made by S&L, but discussing it here has opened possibilities and a healthy discussion has ensued. There are similarities to Assman hardware. The eagles on S&L's have a thin silver wash, which the badge that started this thread does not. The wreath as we both stated is a seldom seen type, I know of only two badges with it. Good things to note and learn from.

[Dougie]

I like the crispy-ness of those wreaths
realy nice things!!

[Mike Yokum]

Here are some comparison pics showing the differences between S&L, Deumer and this Glider...