Early Luft Para Badge

[LuckyLuudje]

I honestly don't know why the hole is in the wreath.
But I posted it because It would be interesting in the discussion about using wartime parts or using the wartime dies.

There is absolutely no doubt about the originality.
I know the holder of the badge and it came with a group.

Could it be possible that these wreaths are actually wartime leftovers.
Wouldn't it be much easier to stamp some new wreaths in stead of repairing the wreath if they still had the wartime dies? (or were the dies worn out?).

[Mike Yokum]

I honestly don't know why the hole is in the wreath.
But I posted it because It would be interesting in the discussion about using wartime parts or using the wartime dies.

There is absolutely no doubt about the originality.
I know the holder of the badge and it came with a group.

Could it be possible that these wreaths are actually wartime leftovers.
Wouldn't it be much easier to stamp some new wreaths in stead of repairing the wreath if they still had the wartime dies? (or were the dies worn out?).

It is indeed an interesting badge worthy of discussion. Originality is in no way questionable.

It is possible that these are wartime leftovers. Your logic is sound. If they had the dies, new wreaths could have been easily made. The only other scenario that comes to mind is that these were made on the cheap. Use whatever, where ever to get pieces made in the very cheapest means possible. I don't think that type of manufacturing came about until the mid to late 70's though.

Of course economical means were always used, but not the type that would allow an early piece to pass quality standards with a hole in the wreath if it could be avoided.

[Thomas Durante]

Hi guys,

My guess would be a simple mistake of drilling the hole in the wrong spot. Wartime S&L paras were consistent in having the left rivet go through the 4th leaf, and this 57 para appears to have the hole going through the 5th leaf instead. Instead of tossing away the wreath, they chose to fix it and save a bit of material, makes perfect sense to me.

Mike, I checked out your 57 Heer para from the other thread you linked in, I really like it! And I would agree on the assessment of it being made by Deumer, those rivets are undeniable Deumer IMO.

Very nice badges guys.

Tom

[Mike Yokum]

I mentioned in the first post in this thread that the eagles talon area did not have the same shear marks from the die as the rest of the eagle and that I thought perhaps that was an indicator of the eagle possibly being a wartime leftover.

Today I did my best to get some better pics of the badge in general and also of this particular area of the badge. While not good enough focus to show the file marks, which are really only visible with a jewelers loupe, you can clearly see this area is not the same as the rest of the badge, at least in my estimation. Also of note is that the tips of the talons are ever so slightly removed. This could be nothing more than an area that required a bit of hand finishing.

I'd love to hear your thoughts.

[Mike Yokum]

And another just to show off!

[streptile]

Mike,

Great new photos. I've just re-read through the thread, and I think it's almost certain that yours is made from wartime leftover parts with the swastika filed away, just based on the information you've provided and what others have added. This photo (your second) is very convincing in that regard:



I assume that any award made from wartime leftovers would be among the earliest possible examples.

By the way, does this kind of long, thin pin ever show up on wartime examples? I ask because, if so, I'd think it would be very hard to distinguish an early '57er made from leftover parts from a wartime-awarded example that was professionally (or competently) denazified. After all, a recipient could easily file off the swastika and produce this badge for his own personal wear. We've seen it with many, many EKs. Those, however, show the damage. This one wouldn't necessarily have to, so the pin would be a determining factor.

I'm really just thinking aloud. I don't even know if these are ever found denazified (known wartime hardware, no swastika)?

In any event, it's an absolutely stunning piece. Congratulations!

[streptile]

Originally Posted by mbizy>
This filing was done prior to finishing.

Hey Mike,

I'm responding to myself. I was just thinking about my last post and remembered that you indicated above that the filing was done prior to finishing. It doesn't seem to be the case based on your new photos (filed area seems darker), but that may be the lighting. Is it unmistakable in-hand that the talon area was not filed away after the bird was gilded? If so, that answers my earlier question.

Thanks,

[Mike Yokum]

Hi Trev,

Some very good insights and questions!

First, the area that appears to be filed has finish on it. It simply has a slightly darker patina in that section.

Second, the Para badge as most 57er's could not simply be de-Nazified. The eagles are in entirely different positions than their TR brothers. Check some Pilot, Observer or Para side by side and you will see the eagles on New Form badges sit much lower than the TR versions as if the Swastika was never part of the design. In many cases it seems the dies were modified to remove the Swastika. In others perhaps entirely new dies were created. I'm certainly no expert in this part of the hobby! This is conjecture on my part!

Lastly, the pin or needle size and style is very similar on TR and early New Form versions. Catches and hinges vary from maker to maker. It's known that leftover hardware in general was often used on the early pieces.

[streptile]

Got it. Interesting.

Thanks, Mike.

Second, the Para badge as most 57er's could not simply be de-Nazified. The eagles are in entirely different positions than their TR brothers...the eagles on New Form badges sit much lower than the TR versions.

Couldn't this very fact explain the filled hole in Luud's example, shown below? Or is not in the correct position for the wartime models, either?



Best,

[Mike Yokum]

Got it. Interesting.

Thanks, Mike.

Couldn't this very fact explain the filled hole in Luud's example, shown below? Or is not in the correct position for the wartime models, either?

Best,

It could Trev, although I think the holes on both sides of the wreath would need to be higher unless the wreath was originally intended for a different style badge altogether which is possible, but no other badges come to mind that would need anything close to this rivet configuration.

[streptile]

It could Trev, although...

Yeah, I did a quick comparison and it seems the hole in Luud's is just slightly too high for it to have been an old wartime wreath. But who knows?

[Matthieu]

Interesting stuff, guys .

[DavidM]

Hello

Mike, an absolutely beautiful, very early Luftwaffe Para badge

Regards
David

[Mike Yokum]

I had this badge out again today and because I like it so very much I took a few more glamour shots of it. i hope you don't mind seeing again and again and again...

[Mike Yokum]

another...