1905/1917 Bayonet

[Rick C]

Don’t know the first thing about bayonets, American or otherwise. I’m researching this in order to move it down the road. My sister pulled out of my Mom’s cousin’s house. I believe it belonged to her Dad as there was some of his insignia, a few patriotic handkerchiefs, a brass whistle, etc. wrapped up with this toad poker.

The scabbard looks damn near pristine; its leather is stamped JEWELL-1918 while the metal part (reverse) is stamped MS. By the button release I’m guessing it’s a 1905 - production knife. The blade’s 16”.

I hoping I can get some detail of what I have and an approximation of what I should try to get for it.

[Rick C]

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[Milton]

Hello Rick. Appears to be a standard '05 bayonet, housed in a replacement 1917 type sheath, pretty standard replacement scabbard used in the immediate pre-WWII period. Looks to be in pretty good original, issued condition, too...

[Johnny Peppers]

The Model 1905 Bayonet blade was polished bright up until 1917 when the finish was changed to phosphate. The original scabbard would have been a Model 1910 canvas covered with a leather tip.

The scabbard shown in your photo is standard for the Model 1917 Bayonet and made in 1918.

This is a Model 1905 dated 1916 with the bright finish blade and Model 1910 scabbard'

[Rick C]

Thanx very much guys.

So, the finish of the blade and scabbard places it around 1917/18.

I thought the Jewell-1918 stamp on the scabbard was interesting where I searched that and didn't find anything. Then I remembered another toad poker (dust collector) I had laying around here (also needing a home) that was stamped Jewell - 1918 (http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...12250#poststop)

Can either of you provide some guidance on what I should try to ask for this when I throw it on the stand?

Thanx again, Rick

[Johnny Peppers]

The date on the blade puts manufacture at 1917 . The finish just happened to be changed in 1917. Not the original scabbard, but nice condition.

[Svt40]

The Model 1905 Bayonet blade was polished bright up until 1917 when the finish was changed to phosphate.

One correction, the M1905 bayonets were blued starting in 1917 and a blued blade is rather scarce to find. In late 1918 they began to parkerize the blades.

[Rick C]

So, if I'm not mistaken, this example is pakerized vs blued? Thus, we might presume a 1918 issuance? which would go along with the Jewell/1918 stamped sheath?

Still wondering about a value if any of you might provide guidance.

[Johnny Peppers]

One correction, the M1905 bayonets were blued starting in 1917 and a blued blade is rather scarce to find. In late 1918 they began to parkerize the blades.

I really don't collect them, so just going by what Cole says. He indicate change to phosphate in 1917 with some being blued. Blade on OP's bayonet looked phosphate.

[Johnny Peppers]

So, if I'm not mistaken, this example is pakerized vs blued? Thus, we might presume a 1918 issuance? which would go along with the Jewell/1918 stamped sheath?

Still wondering about a value if any of you might provide guidance.

Blades were marked with date of manufacture, so no way to tell if issued in 1917 (probably) or 1918.

The Jewel scabbards were not issued with the Model 1905 bayonets. The scabbard could have been swapped anytime in the last 100 years.

I would check some of the web sites like Gunbroker to get an idea of what Model 1905 bayonets have been selling for.

[Svt40]

Really hard to tell what finish it actually has from the pictures (looks blued). The parkerizing they used starting in 1918 was a very dark color, almost black.

You also have to remember they took earlier blades and refinished them to the current specification whenever they were brought in for rework. This is one reason why the bright and blued blades are so much more difficult to find.