Help with 2 Japanese swords

[scotty1418]

I'm speaking to a seller about a number of items including two Japanese swords.

Can anything worthwhile be determined about these two based on the sheathed pictures provided?

Appreciate any thoughts!

[BruceP]

Not much, and I see 3 Japanese style swords - 2 IJA Officer gunto and one Model 19 Cavalry sword (just to the right of the second Officer gunto. The two officer gunto have the appearance of Type 94 (the double belt hanger, in leather scabbard cover) and Type 98 (single belt hanger).

I've never seen a Type 94 in leather saya (scabbard), and don't know if it's legit (there are many fakes on the market). Without more pics, it's not possible to say if either of the officer gunto are legit. The only one that looks legit is the Model 19 - it's a company grade officer sword, model introduced, if memory serves me, in 1896 and made through the early 1930's - ish.

[scotty1418]

Thanks! Without a full takedown, are there a couple key pictures of both guntos that would help clarify?

[oldhonda]

My red alert alarm went off. They don't look good. To me anyway.

[Steve Flanagan]

Swords

Just the wrap on the hilts from the start

[Staldion]

Hi fellows,

I agree with oldhonda, better pictures are mandatory in order to help you any further.

With the pics provided I can already tell you that I don't feel the first one from the left. Leather looks new. I don't like thoose big brass buttons. Too wide, shiny, and a waste of raw material. That's the kind you see on most leather covered chineese fakes.

The second katana looks to have been badly rewarped isn't it? We can't see much so I won't even risk an opinion about authenticity, sorry.

We would need as many close clear pic as possible, from the fittings to the blade (obviously blade is the most valuable thing in a sword, but I have never seen a genuine blade in faked fittings). Tang included of course. If it's signed, it's there.

Bruce > Hi mate,

They do fakes of Type 94! Actually they are more Type 98 with wrong suspension rings, often without pierced tsuba. Most of the time on leather covered saya. As you know gunto's full weather cover is a field with countless variations. The lack of regulation offers more liberty for the fakers.

Hoping I am wrong. Again, hard to tell si far from the items.

Best regards to all of you,
Mat'

[Sengoku]

Very suspect, Chinese style Ito-maki, Saya too narrow , pop studs too big and shiny.

[gunto]

Both japanese shingunto’s are fakes from China. No doubt! Only the parade sword is genuine.

[scotty1418]

Thanks to all for your help!