Japanese officers sword

[Phronsias]

Hi
I would be very grateful if you could give me your opinion on this sword.
http://www.victorymilitaria.com/inve...productId=4737
Thanks
Frank

[Rod G]

Just at a glance it's got an army pommel Frank, says it's a navy sword.

Rod

[Phronsias]

Just at a glance it's got an army pommel Frank.

Rod

Hi Rod and Thanks
Is it worth buying?
Regards
Frank

[gunto]

Its been seen cheaper on ebay.
Its a late war army shingunto.

[GHP]

"...Clean arsenal stamp and kanji maker mark...."

There is no kanji maker mark -- that kanji is a painted assembly number 6: 六 .


As for the temper line, it will be acid-etched or otherwise cosmetically applied; not a true temper line. This aspect is typical with the (⚓) stainless steel swords.



--Guy

[GHP]

Its been seen cheaper on ebay.
Its a late war army shingunto.

Gunto,


Army? Am I looking at the wrong item? The one I see is Navy and has the (⚓) arsenal stamp.


--Guy

[Bob Coleman]

The sword is a hybrid between army and navy form. I have seen these before. They are considered to be naval landing force officer swords that were adapted due to the fact that the true naval mount was not suited to combat wear. 30+ years ago, I purchased a similar sword directly from a veteran that also had the brown naval portopee attached. The blade on the subject sword is stainless steel and I would not want it due to the end of the tang being cut off.

[Phronsias]

Thanks for the advice.
I'll keep looking
Thanks again
Frank

[gunto]

I guess the navy sword arsenal had the blades in stock late war and supported the army. It has army look and in the late war the army used brown tassels too.

[bangbangsan]

I guess the navy sword arsenal had the blades in stock late war and supported the army. It has army look and in the late war the army used brown tassels too.

It‘s a late war Navy(海軍）sword,(has convas warp handle instead of rayskin, the scabbard dunt have rayskin either,only 1 hanger)Not the Army(陸軍)or the NLF(海軍陸戦隊）Sword.
It has the anchor（錨）mark.
陸軍と同じく太平洋戦争開戦以降は外装品位の低下が起き、普通塗料による鞘塗装や略式外装も普及し、194 5年には更に臨時特例（佩環を1個に省略、部品の省略、革巻き鞘）が出された。
http://ohmura-study.net/730.html

[Stu W]

It‘s a late war Navy(海軍）sword,(has convas warp handle instead of rayskin, the scabbard dunt have rayskin either,only 1 hanger)Not the Army(陸軍)or the NLF(海軍陸戦隊）Sword.
It has the anchor（錨）mark.
陸軍と同じく太平洋戦争開戦以降は外装品位の低下が起き、普通塗料による鞘塗装や略式外装も普及し、194 5年には更に臨時特例（佩環を1個に省略、部品の省略、革巻き鞘）が出された。
http://ohmura-study.net/730.html

Hello bangbangsan,

If you believe it to be late war Navy how do you account for the presence of Army tsuka and scabbard fitting? I'm not saying you are incorrect, just want to know the line of reasoning taken to that belief.

Also, can you advise where in the linked Ohmura site support for the belief is located or are you perhaps just making reference to the anchor stamped blade?

Thank you in advance.

Regards,
Stu

[bangbangsan]

Hello bangbangsan,

If you believe it to be late war Navy how do you account for the presence of Army tsuka and scabbard fitting? I'm not saying you are incorrect, just want to know the line of reasoning taken to that belief.

Also, can you advise where in the linked Ohmura site support for the belief is located or are you perhaps just making reference to the anchor stamped blade?

Thank you in advance.

Regards,
Stu

Hey Stu
I knew you are Gunto expert ,and I mean it.
About this sword,in my opinion,the anchor stamped blade should be Navy gunto BLADE,the fitting(sakura menuki) & scarbbard are normaly used by army,but the Blade and the Tsuba should be Navy's ,right?Or I should say it's a NAVY gunto balde with some Army gunto parts.
To me ,in this case the blade should be main reason.
That's just my opinion.Here is the link where I saw the late war Navy gunto saya had only 1 instead of 2 hanger.
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/軍刀
I've learned alot from the members had very specialized knowledge like Nick ,GHP &you.
Share info &get to know the things that I dunt know b4 is what I like about this fourm.
Thanks guys!

[BruceP]

Gentlemen, I don't know if anyone is still interested in this thread, but I have seen several of these swords. The tsuka, saya, and blade are navy, but the menuki, semegane and ishizuki are army. Some call them "pieced together" post war swords, but I don't think so. They are always identical. I have always assumed it was because we had been bombing the snot out of manufacturing plants and the remaining plants were just taking parts from where ever they could get them. I have read something recently, though, that makes it look like the marines' swords were outfitted this way.

I have a pic from a freind whose uncle brought this one back from Iwo Jima, which I'd post but I'm new and don't know how to upload it!

[Stu W]

Hello Bruce,

Welcome to the forum.

Late war Army with Navy blade or late war Navy with Army fitting? Regardless of how they are described (and this topic comes up often) I think these were likely born out of necessity, due to material shortages as you suggest, and used by whatever branch of service required them at the time. There is a similarly looking post war put together out there in significant numbers too.

Bottom line for me is I'd rather pass them by and put my money into a standard Shin-gunto of Type 3, 94 or 98 or a Kai-gunto of the Type 97 configuration.

As to you not being able to post photos ... I believe you still need to be an "Association Member" to post directly to the site. Cost is $25 USD per year.

Again, welcome, and I look forward to you contributing more here as your time permits.

Regards,
Stu
PS:I say this with a smile and no offence meant but I'd take that Iwo Jima bring back info you got from your friend with a pinch, or perhaps a pound, of salt. I wish I had a dollar for every sword I've read about that came off Iwo Jima.

[RussellM]

Posting a pic for Bruce.

Regards

Russ