Japanese Flag

[Knight]

This is the Japanese flag, my collection. Have invited experts to look at it, very grateful!
http://www.shou-cang.com/bbs/viewthr...tra=#pid360149

[Knight]

No one know? Thank you！

[Striking 9th]

Welcome to the forum Knight. I am by no means an expert on these. I think the kanji on the subject flag is suspect. Looks like it is all in the same hand. Like I said though this is out of my realm of collecting. I can say if it were offered to me I would pass. Just my opinion.
Scott

[Nick Komiya]

I remember seeing this flag. I am also not very comfortable with the way the signatures are done, but at least the company related inscriptions make sense. The soldier was an employee of Sumitomo Trust and must have joined the company in the 2nd year of Showa (1927), as the flag is presented by his buddies that belongs to the Showa 2nd Association (class of 1927). The company was established in 1925, so all this makes sense.
What I don't like about the signatures, apart from what Scott mentions, is the fact that those who signed do not show familiarity with writing with a brush, but rather with pen calligraphy how they carry the strokes, which is odd for those days.
I cannot say it's a fake, but in view of the fakes now coming from Japan these days there's simply not enough margin of comfort in this flag for me.

[Jeremy92]

Does not look good.

[Knight]

Thank you! On the signature, it does not meet the Japanese habit?
I observed, this is not a person can write. Anyway, thank you again!

[oldflagswanted]

kanji & corners ???

...not very comfortable with the way the signatures are done
...those who signed do not show familiarity with writing with a brush
...cannot say it's a fake, but in view of the fakes now coming from Japan these
days there's simply not enough margin of comfort in this flag for me.

NK:
Interesting kanji observations, I surely defer to your expertise
in that regard. To my eye it seems that the corner supports are odd.
Has anyone seen this material used rather than leather or gilt/silver paper?

[Nick Komiya]

You need to bear in mind that the only writing medium they had in those days for signing flags was a brush, you wouldn't be able to do it with a pen.
When you sign with a brush, how you lift your brush at the end of the stroke is critical. If you linger, the ink will continue to run into the cloth and create an unsightly mess. Instead, you lift the brush gradually, but in a fluid motion to let the stroke taper out into a tail.
With the advent of modern felt-tipped pens that don't have such a ink run problem, you can now write in a more jerky way with sharp edges and sudden stroke terminations, the way you would do with a pen or pencil. Also, with a brush the thickness of the line will vary according to the pressure you apply, whereas with a felt-tipped pen it will be more uniform.
A lot of the writting on this flag show traits you cannot achieve with a brush.
Accuracy of historic content in this case needs to be discounted, because a faker only has to copy a real flag to get that right.
I don't know how often Chinese people use a brush to write these days, but imagine how you would do this flag in brush and you'll start to see what I mean.
Calligraphy is also an important point in authenticating official German Knights Cross documents, where the golden lettering needs to be done with the right pen to look right.

[Knight]

I remember seeing this flag. I am also not very comfortable with the way the signatures are done, but at least the company related inscriptions make sense. The soldier was an employee of Sumitomo Trust and must have joined the company in the 2nd year of Showa (1927), as the flag is presented by his buddies that belongs to the Showa 2nd Association (class of 1927). The company was established in 1925, so all this makes sense.
What I don't like about the signatures, apart from what Scott mentions, is the fact that those who signed do not show familiarity with writing with a brush, but rather with pen calligraphy how they carry the strokes, which is odd for those days.
I cannot say it's a fake, but in view of the fakes now coming from Japan these days there's simply not enough margin of comfort in this flag for me.

Thank you for your comment! You mean the flag from the 1927's, is real. But all the signature is fake. The kanji "祈武运长久" is also fake?

[Nick Komiya]

Thank you for your comment! You mean the flag from the 1927's, is real. But all the signature is fake. The kanji "祈武运长久" is also fake?

To be blunt, yes, it's probably fake.
Blank flags from the war are fairly easy to find. Then you need two or so friends to join in the faking. One will specialize in the squiggly cursive writing and another in orthodox writing, etc. To hide the fact that the same person is signing several names, you take turns so two of your squiggly signatures don't
stand next to each other. By trying to hide a pattern, you end up creating a pattern of regular alternating writing styles.
There are many other things to look for. When one writes an old kanji no longer used, one needs to pay special attention not to write it the modern way out of habit, and that special attention shows.

[Knight]

Grateful for your comments! I do not understand the motive of making false thing is to make money right? True value of the original flag ONLY 100-300 dollars, the cost of false flags may be even higher than the original, I really do not understand. For money in the crazy world!

[Nick Komiya]

Blank flags can be found quite cheap, so it's still good business for small time crooks.

[Jareth]

as Nick said plus original flags that are sparsely signed can have additional contemporary kanji added plus tigers etc.

[Striking 9th]

NK:
Interesting kanji observations, I surely defer to your expertise
[B]in that regard. To my eye it seems that the corner supports are odd.

I saw one just today still in the possession of the vet that had very similar corners. Can't remember if they were exactly the same but I think they were. Seems like I have seen another as well. It was from a 4th Marine Div vet picked up on Iwo. I think I posted it some time back. The one I saw today looked pretty neat!!!!
Scott

[Knight]

Look at this flag is brush cursive Chinese characters Left side of the sun, in fact, brush calligraphy cursive is the highest state.Thanks!

http://www.germanmilitaria.com/Japan...s/J000861.html