Billy Kramer

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OK -- REALLY need everyone's help here!!! <----

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    OK -- REALLY need everyone's help here!!! <----

    OK here is the helmet I bought,

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWN:IT&ih=025

    Waf members here gave it the thubs up but after paying I got a message that I need to look at the chin ties closer.

    I got this from a concerned collector,


    ((((((((((((((((William, not to be an alarmist but you need to take a close look at those chinstraps. If he hasn't sent the item to you yet ask for a closeup(s) of the chinstraps. Somethings just doesn't look right about them. At least one of them seem to have the thread pattern going the wrong way and neither of them look folded over and sewn into a triangular tip, which is how all full length straps are made. As long as you can get an inspection period on the item all of these things can be addressed with the item in hand.

    I also don't like the way the cord in the helmet top (that holds the three pads together) looks, however the photo's are not sharp enough to really tell. Do you have a UV (black light)? I'd illuminate all the cords to see if any modern threads have been used. "IF" the straps are not original ones then he violated his description and you might have a right to return the item although he did not state any wording in his auction about returns.

    I can give you my honest opinion on the item when you have it. Everything I am saying is known "tribal knowledge" and can be verified even by looking at quality pictures in other auctions of "known good" items. But that's the trick - knowing what to look for and what is "good". Much (not most) of the historical militaria stuff on eBay is either bad or "messed with" in some way - as I'm sure you have found in your area of collecting interest also.

    Sincerely)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

    I am posting some photos and please give me as much feed back and advice as you can. I hope the forum's moderators will chime in too, they seem to know their stuff but I don't see any recent posts by them.

    Here are two photos for review.

    I like the helmet, even better in fact then the nice Army covered and netted example I lost out on the same time Banzi won the nice naval one but I don't want to get taken on something less then completly original even if the price was good.

    If it's good i want the helmet. If bad, what do you all suggest? Full refund or a credit for lower sale price and keep it anyway since I like the shell itself?

    William
    Attached Files

    #2
    Should I have the seller ship it and use the black light or are the photos conclusive?

    W.
    Attached Files

    Comment


      #3
      There is nothing to worry about it's fine

      Comment


        #4
        As Banzi64 said, nothing wrong with it at all. Other than the moth eaten star (unfortunately the stars on these are apparently very tasty), its a nice original helmet and cover.

        CB

        Comment


          #5
          Based on the out of focus photos I see no warning signs other than the chinstraps which are either cut or shortened as the full length have the tips sewn into points. It doesn't hurt to ALWAYS black light every piece of cloth you buy.

          Comment


            #6
            I would love to know what they used to dye the anchors and stars. I am sure it is a fruit dye the way the moths eat them. Another thing to add to the helmet and soft cap outline. It would take a lab to determine what was used, but it could be done.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Banzi64 View Post
              I would love to know what they used to dye the anchors and stars. I am sure it is a fruit dye the way the moths eat them. Another thing to add to the helmet and soft cap outline. It would take a lab to determine what was used, but it could be done.

              That looks like the same thread pattern on the helmet I just posted about here, with the battlefield repair.

              Is the Japanese helmet market as prone to rip offs as the German?

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by keith View Post
                That looks like the same thread pattern on the helmet I just posted about here, with the battlefield repair.

                Is the Japanese helmet market as prone to rip offs as the German?
                I was under the impression that the answer is no, not near as bad. The Collector who wrote me really knows his stuff however. If the Mods come in on this and say it's good that might seal the deal. I don't mind shortened chin ties, the solder's did that themselves. Thanks for all the replies so far!

                W.

                Comment


                  #9
                  There are a few sources for repro chinstraps & they look some what close. Sometimes a hands on inspection is the best especially if the seller offers return priviledges. Every seller has a different policy so it pays to ask first. Curious as to why the "Collector" choose to PM rather than post to be anonymous? Interesting. It's my belief that most shortened chinstraps were from severe wear/frayed, cut by G.I.s to remove helmet from corpse & not by the Japanese. No proof just opinion.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by PlaceOfBayonets View Post
                    Should I have the seller ship it and use the black light or are the photos conclusive?

                    W.
                    If hes talking about the thread pattern being wrong on the back strap, this strap which I assume is a battlefield repair has the same pattern...

                    Comment


                      #11
                      dood you are wasting your time sweating this chinstrap whomever pmed you doesn't know anything. To me it looks like a late war navy chinstrap it could have been replaced

                      Comment


                        #12
                        I talked to Sheldon last night. One of the subjects was this helmet. It is not the strap most seen but there is nothing at all wrong with it. Many people who know this stuff inside and out have posted on this thread and approved. I don't know what more can be said to ease your mind. They are fine. It is not worth losing sleep and tearing yourself up over it. I know how it is. I have been there. Rest easy tonight. You did good.
                        Scott

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Honestly guys these issues are so far over my newb head that I really don't understand the whole issue that was brought up by the collector who messaged me.

                          I got the idea that the threads might have been re done. Maybe maybe not. This kinda thing can happen and a seller might not even know it.

                          Other then that I am getting the jist that maybe the rear chin tie holder thingy ma'bob was replaced with a Navel liner part. Did this happen? So if that's the case looks to be original according to Banzi. At worse it's a "parts" helmet with maybe new stitching and some period repairs?

                          I hope the mods chime in and maybe the mystery collector will give me his opinion based on the photos in the morning. He said the auction ones were not good enough to make a call.

                          Maybe I will direct the seller to send the helm in the morning.

                          Just wanted to be sure. I have an inbread paranoia with helmets do to my German collecting and a few mistakes I've made.



                          Wilhelm

                          PS, just to illustraight how diverse opinions can be, Sheldon told me that late war naval helmet shell I sent back as suspected post war repaint was good. He even wanted to know if it was still for sale.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Banzi64 View Post
                            dood you are wasting your time sweating this chinstrap whomever pmed you doesn't know anything. To me it looks like a late war navy chinstrap it could have been replaced
                            Banzi,

                            Would you say the cover fits the helmet properly?

                            W.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              I really wanted Eric Doody's opinion on the matter but I see he's not logged in since August.

                              So I've directed the seller to send me the helmet.

                              W.

                              Comment

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