Help with picklehaube cover with REg numbers

[Tony & Kaiser]

RelicHunter, you are correct. By all rights, no German should have been wearing an Überzug with numbers or letters after 27 Oct 1916. I wrote a simple guide to Überzug HERE.

In my opinion, any Überzug with numbers/letters whatever, was taken as a souvenir on a helmet by an Allied soldier before that date.

Unlike many collectors who leap to give an opinion on something they know nothing about, I will not. I don't collect these as I am only after one (IR82) so I cannot give an educated comment on any of these. All I will say, is that if I wanted one, I would not hesitate to buy either of the two that Roy posted.

There is a good debate on these HERE worth reading.

It also makes me question how many of each survived from the time period. The red numbers were to be replaced by green, and then those replaced by blanks when the war was raging. So how many original red numbered covers would have made it through the war intact? I don't know. Someone with more knowledge on the subject would have to comment on that, because I'd be curious to know. It seems like, from what I've seen, the green are more rare than the red. And the 1915 models with removable spikes and blank seem to be fairly rare also. I would think the red ones would be the rarest because they were subject to the most change. But they were also in existence for ten times longer than the greens and blanks.

[Spanish Freiwillige]

RelicHunter, you are correct. By all rights, no German should have been wearing an Überzug with numbers or letters after 27 Oct 1916. I wrote a simple guide to Überzug HERE.

In my opinion, any Überzug with numbers/letters whatever, was taken as a souvenir on a helmet by an Allied soldier before that date.

Unlike many collectors who leap to give an opinion on something they know nothing about, I will not. I don't collect these as I am only after one (IR82) so I cannot give an educated comment on any of these. All I will say, is that if I wanted one, I would not hesitate to buy either of the two that Roy posted.

There is a good debate on these HERE worth reading.

Thanks for the links they are great!!!

[Spanish Freiwillige]

here is a photo of my only cover:



no numbers.......









wanted to give this impresion....

[RelicHunter]

RelicHunter, you are correct. By all rights, no German should have been wearing an Überzug with numbers or letters after 27 Oct 1916. I wrote a simple guide to Überzug HERE.

In my opinion, any Überzug with numbers/letters whatever, was taken as a souvenir on a helmet by an Allied soldier before that date.

Unlike many collectors who leap to give an opinion on something they know nothing about, I will not. I don't collect these as I am only after one (IR82) so I cannot give an educated comment on any of these. All I will say, is that if I wanted one, I would not hesitate to buy either of the two that Roy posted.

There is a good debate on these HERE worth reading.

Tony, do you think there is any truth to the possibility that there were stores of covers with red numbers that were put away (and not used again) before and during the war?

To me it seems unlikely, because of the constant need for material. Why keep a batch of covers in storage for no reason? That's why I continue to think that the red numbered covers SHOULD be the rarest.

[Spanish Freiwillige]

Tony, do you think there is any truth to the possibility that there were stores of covers with red numbers that were put away (and not used again) before and during the war?

To me it seems unlikely, because of the constant need for material. Why keep a batch of covers in storage for no reason? That's why I continue to think that the red numbered covers SHOULD be the rarest.

A lot of things that can’t be explained happen in history, specially with what regulations say and what actually happens, also with the supply and use of military items........

I guess that yes most would have been used, but what if new covers were supplied and the older ones were just put in storage......and later due to shortages reissued or never used again.....


That is the great thing about studying history you think one thing and suddenly evidence appears that contradicts, sometimes in general terms, sometimes in just individual practices....

[Tony & Kaiser]

No idea. Its seems unlikely, but who knows? I agree though, Überzug with red numbers "should" be rarer than green but then again, as all numbers and letters were ordered removed, they should all be rare yes?

Tony, do you think there is any truth to the possibility that there were stores of covers with red numbers that were put away (and not used again) before and during the war?

To me it seems unlikely, because of the constant need for material. Why keep a batch of covers in storage for no reason? That's why I continue to think that the red numbered covers SHOULD be the rarest.

[RelicHunter]

No idea. Its seems unlikely, but who knows? I agree though, Überzug with red numbers "should" be rarer than green but then again, as all numbers and letters were ordered removed, they should all be rare yes?

I agree. Although you would think green would be a bit more common than red, because before the numbers were ordered removed, the green numbers would have been in the field for some time, giving the allied armies the opportunity to collect them as souvenirs.

[C. Roelens]

Excellent links Tony. To all, excellent discussion... much appreciated.

Chuck

[RelicHunter]

Since its sort of on topic, anyone seen the new War Horse trailer? Featuring an entire company of German soldiers wearing pickelhaube covers with red numbers while fighting the British cavalry.

[Spanish Freiwillige]

Since its sort of on topic, anyone seen the new War Horse trailer? Featuring an entire company of German soldiers wearing pickelhaube covers with red numbers while fighting the British cavalry.

War Horse??

Is that a new movie??

[MauserKar98k]

War Horse??

Is that a new movie??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7lf9...feature=relmfu

For those interested. Plot seems sappy as all get-out IMHO. Still might be worth a rent for the battle scenes though.

[Hoss]

Blimey
'War Horse Go Home' another Speilberg nonsense.

What a waste of a battlefield. Make a great gig hang out.

Eric

[Spanish Freiwillige]

When did this one comeo out??

[RelicHunter]

When did this one comeo out??

It comes out this Christmas. Based on a children's book I believe, but with some adult war content added in thus giving it a PG-13 rating. I believe the plot centers around a British kid and his horse, when the horse gets "drafted" into the cavalry. I believe the horse ends up spending parts of the war on the British, German and French lines. Thus the movie should depict its interactions with the players of the war.

Not sure what the Spielberg hate is for the last few posts. The man has done nothing but service to the film industry and veterans in this country. I get that some people may want a documentary about the war rather than an actual story, but remember, movies aren't just for the niche group of military enthusiasts. They have to appeal to the masses as well.

[Hoss]

It comes out this Christmas. Based on a children's book I believe, but with some adult war content added in thus giving it a PG-13 rating. I believe the plot centers around a British kid and his horse, when the horse gets "drafted" into the cavalry. I believe the horse ends up spending parts of the war on the British, German and French lines. Thus the movie should depict its interactions with the players of the war.

Not sure what the Spielberg hate is for the last few posts. The man has done nothing but service to the film industry and veterans in this country. I get that some people may want a documentary about the war rather than an actual story, but remember, movies aren't just for the niche group of military enthusiasts. They have to appeal to the masses as well.

Sir
My light banter may have missed the spot I guess. Sorry but Spielberg's movies all have the same theme usually involving children or fake tugs at the heart strings (Private Ryan with a hidden political message, least we ever forget)) or an animal or something that if we saw it in our kitchens would result in a heart attack or running for a 38.
Released at Christmas no doubt along with a game to put under the tree for Christmas morning ect....

I agree Mr Spielberg is of great service to the film industry.

For a beautiful heart warming story I recommend 'A Very Long Engagement' this only has a few trench scenes yet is a wonderful period story that blows anything Spielberg does out the water for us non masses and masses alike.

Regards
Eric