WUERTEMBERG MMO, GROUP to MAJOR

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

Dear Collectors:
In this group we find the scarce Wuertemberg Military Merit Order, Knight, in Gold. A nice small group to I believe a Major. With my German not being that good, I can't make out the writing on the pictures. To my friend Rick, any and all help as to who this gentleman is would be appreciated. To my fellow collectors I would hope you enjoy this seldom seen Order and if anyone else has one, please share your pictures in this thread. This Order is the type 5, 1892 with initials "WR" on the reverse. Thanks for looking.
Sincerely, Bill

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

#2

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

#3

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

#4

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

#5

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

#6

[VtwinVince]

This photo was taken at Loewen (Belgium), August 1914, and shows Feldkriegsgerichtsrat Dr. Franz Ivers (military lawyer) and below it says that he is the brother of Amtsgerichtsrat Dr. Cay Ivers, also a lawyer.

[Rick Research]

Ahhh.... I know where THAT came from.

The GOOD news is that this is a superb group, in dazzling completeness


to a junior officer from Württemberg.

The BAD news is, from what I could see of this when it was originally posted on THAT particular dealer's website, that the photographs have absolutely NO connection that I can see to the awards, whatsoever.

I find NO Württemberg Ivers in the Orders Almanac or in the Württemberg Court and State Handbook, WW1 era Rank Lists, secret 1917 XIII Corps Home Establishment List, et cetera. They appear to have been a Prussian tribe, located if anyplace around Stettin. While this may well have been a wife's father (someplace in there is something mentioning being an 1870 veteran, as I recall).

The group did NOT belong to the elderly portly gentleman pictured-- a war's duration Judge Advocate legal branch "Major." This particular Legendary Dealer is notable for...


an excess of unsupportable assumption, one reason for which is his inability to read German combined with a basic lack of fundamental knowledge of those little nitty gritties called FACTS. As Ronnie once said, "Trust But Verify." Or rather the reverse, for most claims there. Despite a singular lack of shyness in asking prices, he is often completely, mortifyingly WRONG about descriptions. Asking price does NOT mean a dealer is an expert in what he sells. (Hasn't a clue, for instance, who his current absolutely fantastic world class once in a lifetime untouched original $15K tunic belonged to! Has just sold the extremely rare plane-crashing-into-crown "Pilot Badge" and has whipped up an elaborate $11K Celebrity Item based ENTIRELY on completely mis-attributing the item's owner's Olde Englishe initial M as... FH, oyy! )

This is, for all that, the best and undoubtedly original (not assembled to make a set, but rather miraculously preserved) set of award effects I have seen in MANY years.

When next we have a Lowell (April 2, I believe) I'll be happy to read through the paperwork for you, but unless there is mention of somebody who CAN be found on the 1914-18 MMO award roll (in von Moser, but not the edition I have), there is NO way to trace who this set REALLY belonged to originally.

[ccj]

I can only wonder wo you are talking about.

Ahhh.... I know where THAT came from.

The GOOD news is that this is a superb group, in dazzling completeness


to a junior officer from Württemberg.

The BAD news is, from what I could see of this when it was originally posted on THAT particular dealer's website, that the photographs have absolutely NO connection that I can see to the awards, whatsoever.

I find NO Württemberg Ivers in the Orders Almanac or in the Württemberg Court and State Handbook, WW1 era Rank Lists, secret 1917 XIII Corps Home Establishment List, et cetera. They appear to have been a Prussian tribe, located if anyplace around Stettin. While this may well have been a wife's father (someplace in there is something mentioning being an 1870 veteran, as I recall).

The group did NOT belong to the elderly portly gentleman pictured-- a war's duration Judge Advocate legal branch "Major." This particular Legendary Dealer is notable for...


an excess of unsupportable assumption, one reason for which is his inability to read German combined with a basic lack of fundamental knowledge of those little nitty gritties called FACTS. As Ronnie once said, "Trust But Verify." Or rather the reverse, for most claims there. Despite a singular lack of shyness in asking prices, he is often completely, mortifyingly WRONG about descriptions. Asking price does NOT mean a dealer is an expert in what he sells. (Hasn't a clue, for instance, who his current absolutely fantastic world class once in a lifetime untouched original $15K tunic belonged to! Has just sold the extremely rare plane-crashing-into-crown "Pilot Badge" and has whipped up an elaborate $11K Celebrity Item based ENTIRELY on completely mis-attributing the item's owner's Olde Englishe initial M as... FH, oyy! )

This is, for all that, the best and undoubtedly original (not assembled to make a set, but rather miraculously preserved) set of award effects I have seen in MANY years.

When next we have a Lowell (April 2, I believe) I'll be happy to read through the paperwork for you, but unless there is mention of somebody who CAN be found on the 1914-18 MMO award roll (in von Moser, but not the edition I have), there is NO way to trace who this set REALLY belonged to originally.

[Bob Hunter*]

Thank you, Bill, I enjoyed looking!

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

Well, Well, Well....I have always said "knowledge is power". First, let me thank all of you for your input, especially Rick. As a collector of 40 + years, I have always put the paperwork that accompanys Orders or Groups on the back burner. In this case the MMO alone was worth the price. OK, with that said and my curiosity up...could it be a group of Family pictures?? There is one picture of a young officer with his wife?, girlfriend?, with what looks to be the double ribbon set attached to his tunic button hole that is with this set. He is also leaning on a cane. Could this be from a wound (wound badge)? Also, on the reverse is a different name. Pictures included. Please advise...thank you all.
Sincerely, Bill

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

#2

[Brian S]

Amazing to get such a complete set. It's quite unusual these days.

I think I remember the dealer's photo was once published from his own web site reflecting in a helmet he had for sale. Ah, the good old days...

[Rick Research]

"Ulm bei Major Peter" is written in modern handwriting, I'd say no earlier than 1930s-- but there is no date on when the PHOTO was taken. The only MAJORs Peter there were were BAVARIAN and SAXON:

this chunky and I'd say well into 40s fellow is not field artillery, from his light colored cap band, but cannot make any clearer ID than that without clues beyond 1897+ from the two cockades. While the knee length frock coat WAS worn during and after the war by older officers, it was a 19th century style that was far from fashionable during WW1.

There is no apparent match for anyone with this rank in WW1. The Saxon was artillery, one of the two Bavarians was artillery, and the sole infantry one was STILL a Hauptmann the month the war ended. A pre-war Bavarian infantry Major zD (Karl Peter, born 1864) does not seem to have served during WW1.

[WILLIAM RUSSO]

Dear Rick:
Again, thank you for all your help and research.
Sincerely, Bill