HisCol

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Anatomy of a medal bar identification – GL August Schmidt EKRKE

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Anatomy of a medal bar identification – GL August Schmidt EKRKE

    </O
    I thought I would post this bar and how the identification was done so that it would be saved here before I move the bar to the stand.
    <O</O
    This six place bar was acquired by me at the show in Kassel, Germany in November, 2008. On the bar is:
    <O</O
    1914 Iron Cross 2<SUP>nd</SUP> Class (EK2)
    Bayern Militar-Verdienst Order 4<SUP>th</SUP> Class with Swords and Crown (BMV4XKr)
    Mecklenburg Milirar-Verdienst Cross 2<SUP>nd</SUP> Class (MMV2)
    Hindenburg Cross with Swords
    Third Reich 25 year Long Service Cross (DA25)
    Third Reich 12 year Long Service Cross (DA12)
    <O</O
    <O</O
    To make an attribution we must first know to which German Army the officer served. The holder of this bar was an officer was in the Bavarian Army because of the BMV4XKr and nothing else from Prussia. Now that we know to look in the Bavarian Military Handbook we can try to narrow it down to which regiment to look in. The MMV2 does that because the Duke of Mecklenburg was the honorary Commander of Bavarian Infantry Regiment 21 and he awarded decoration from Mecklenburg to officers in the regiment.
    <O</O
    Decorations that are not on a bar are just as important as what decorations are on the bar. There are no Bavarian Jubilee medals on the bar and they were last given in 1912. The DA25 was not awarded after September 1, 1939 so this officer had to have been in the army beginning at least August, 1914. So we are looking for an officer in Bavarian IR21 who entered service after 1912 and before August, 1914 and stayed in between the wars. That narrows the list down greatly. So we are now looking for an officer who was awarded the BMV4XKr during WWI. The only officers who fits the entire criteria is GL August Schmidt who was the commander of 10<SUP>th</SUP> Infantry Division and holder of the Knights Cross (awarded October 28, 1939) and Oak leaves (awarded January 1, 1944)
    <O</O
    Please wait to reply until you see “LAST POST”
    Attached Files
    Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

    #2
    1914 handbuck entry for IR21, see Duke of Mecklenburg as Chef and Schmidt listed
    Attached Files
    Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

    Comment


      #3
      Also from the handbuck, Schmidt's date of rank.
      Attached Files
      Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

      Comment


        #4
        1924 Army Ranklist with Schmidt's award BM4XmKr is the BMV4XKr and the MK1 is the Mecklenburg Verdienst Cross 1st Class (MMV1) which means he also had the MMV2.
        Attached Files
        Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

        Comment


          #5
          Pre-war photo of Schmidt with all his awards. Notice his ribbon bar which is a match for the medal bar.
          Attached Files
          Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

          Comment


            #6
            Part of Schmidt's service record with award dates.

            LAST POST
            Attached Files
            Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

            Comment


              #7
              Excellent Post, well done with the research.

              I can not see it well, but it looks like the MVO is a late war Orden (after 1917) made Hemmerle?

              Best Regards

              Antonio

              Comment


                #8
                Hi - that´s an nice bar - but in my opinion not unique ("Unikat") - with IC2, MVO4XK
                and the Mecklenburg cross. So it could be another higher rank of the WH/KM.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by römischIX View Post
                  Hi - that´s an nice bar - but in my opinion not unique ("Unikat") - with IC2, MVO4XK
                  and the Mecklenburg cross. So it could be another higher rank of the WH/KM.

                  You are entitled to your opinion but I must ask you how many medal bars or ribbon bars you have traced out? Do you have any of the award rolls? Do you possess any ranklists? Can you tell the difference between a medal bar to an officer from Saxony or Prussia? If you can answer theses questions in a positive manner then your opinion has some validity. One final note this attribution has been confirmed by Rick Lundstrom and Daniel Krause. Two of the finest researchers.
                  Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Hi Paul,

                    Very interesting post. Amazing work you and others are able to do.
                    Best regards,
                    Streptile

                    Looking for ROUND BUTTON 1939 EK1 Spange cases (LDO or PKZ)

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Heran View Post
                      Excellent Post, well done with the research.

                      I can not see it well, but it looks like the MVO is a late war Orden (after 1917) made Hemmerle?

                      Best Regards

                      Antonio
                      Yes, it is late war. His service record dates the award as 20.12.18.
                      Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Good Job!

                        This is something what I like!

                        Regards
                        Seeheld

                        Comment


                          #13
                          It amazes me how you guys are able to trace these bars back to
                          there original owner.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Well done Paul! Enjoyed this post immensely!

                            Comment


                              #15
                              The tracing of medal bars or ribbon bars is not to difficult when you have the resources, time and knowledge. I learned from Rick Lundstrom and there was a group of five of us who shared all of our resources. Sadly this is behind me know as I sell off my collection and pursue another endeavor as an author.
                              Imperial German Medalbars and Ribbonbars

                              Comment

                              Users Viewing this Thread

                              Collapse

                              There is currently 1 user online. 0 members and 1 guests.

                              Most users ever online was 10,032 at 08:13 PM on 09-28-2024.

                              Working...
                              X