sy and wagner ??

[gregM]

I am curious what your thoughts are on this cross. I've already got my opinion but
I wonder if I'm in the minority on this one.

[Jesse]

Real or not, it's not one for me. Trying to remember if I have seen that Mark before. Don't think I have. Definition too soft, catch resoldered?
Hinge looks interesting. Is this a "Frankenstein"?

J

[streptile]

I would hesitate to judge without having it in hand, but in my opinion it's probably a put-together. This cross purports to be an early version, with a cast core, yet S-W's first stamp and pin are well known and they aren't these. So I would be very cautious.

[Rich G]

Wouldn't be one I would buy. It's nothing like an original and you can spot that contrived tarnish a mile off.

[Don D.]

Is it a reduction (prinzen) cross?

[gregM]

Very interesting opinions I am happy that I am not the only one
with some serious doubts about this cross.

Here is what I see. The marking is not a known S-W mark. The core does not
match any other S-W crosses that I could find. The hinge and pin do not match
the usual hardware plus the heat discoloration around where the hinge and catch
look more like what I see with tig welding not old soldering.

[Roglebk]

Cast core, remember the 'crows feet' on inner corners but can't put a maker to it. A bit of color around hinge/catch is normal. See nothing wrong except for the stamp.

[Roglebk]

Maybe S&W early in war used a stamp from their other jewellers stuff.

https://p1.liveauctioneers.com/654/7...830761_3_l.jpg

http://www.lauritz.com/Item/ItemImag...&ImageCount=12

http://193.238.185.184/images/141887...=large&index=9

http://www.lauritz.com/Item/ItemImag...&ImageCount=12

[Tiger 1]

....... plus the heat discoloration around where the hinge and catch
look more like what I see with tig welding not old soldering.

I agree with Greg. The discoloration is not indicative of soldering. It shows the irredescense of tig welding or electric induction welding....very high localized hest.

Not for me.

Tony

[Roglebk]

That cross does not look welded, it looks soldered. Compare a welded seam to a soldered one. They are totally different.

Silver, neusilber and other alloys turns iridescence too.

Have/had several silver crosses and coins with that look, here is one: http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...95&postcount=4

read here
https://www.cointalk.com/threads/wha...-toning.84670/

It doesn't mean the cross is period. Would ask for better pics. Think it's worth a 2nd look, esp as it does not match any known fakes.

Nobody cared to check the marks? Same period jeweller items marks that could be used for crosses too, we saw it before with Godet.

[Roglebk]

Got more shots from Greg. Stamp is 835 which is uncommon. Edges are nice but hinge and catch are badly soldered.

If only could place those crows feet inner corners.

Nothing on it screams S-W, absolutely nothing except for stamps but can not find a match on other Silverware made by S-W.

Bad? Still not sure but probably is.

[gregM]

additional pictures

[gregM]

and---

[Roglebk]

additional pictures

Bottom one in post 12 is reverse of another cross.

[gregM]

Bottom one in post 12 is reverse of another cross.

You are correct. I just removed it.