Austrian Pilot´s Badge, Karl type for review

[Miro O]

Hello,

I would like to hear your opinions about this Austrian pilot´s badge.
To me it looks like good late war badge.

Regards, Miro

[Miro O]

...

[Miro O]

The badge just came in and it is beautiful piece of jeweller´s work.

Thanks to pm to Elmar Lang, who approved my thoughts about this badge, I was sure to obtain it.

I see there is no knowledge about these KuK pilots badges, so maybe it would be good to post some basic infos for future reference.

This is late war version of Karl Type badges with Doppelkrone (both Austrian and Hungarian crowns), which has some specific features:

- hollow rivets
- hollow eagle, thus unmarked
- the ribbon around the crown is not enamelled red and his ends are separate from the crown
- "autumn" leaves (when exposed to the direct light, they glow yellow-green)
- "Big eye" eagle

I am posting better reference photos from emedals, although this badge has one cross at the crown broken off (which is very often seen feature on these badges).

[Miro O]

Here is earlier variant of Karl Type badge with solid rivets, ribbon around crown enamelled red, greener leaves and solid (mostly marked) eagle with smaller eye. As you see, the hardware is different as well.

Photo is taken from Italian Blitzkrieg forum, but I think this is badge and photo by Elmar Lang.

[Miro O]

Here is the comparison of earlier variant of Karl Type badge (left) with widely spread Horvath fake (right). All credits again to Elmar Lang.

[Miro O]

I think Austrian KuK Pilots badges were the inspiration for Third Reich Pilots badges more than German Imperial Ones. There are some similarities that can´t be found on German Imperial badges:

- dominant eagle with wings exceeding the width of laurel wreath
- two piece riveted construction
- cut-out laurel wreath.

This inspiration is even more visible when you compare Austrian Observers badge and Third Reich ROAG badge.

Here is Austrian "ROAG" (not from my collection)

[Don D.]

Thanks for posting this information. These beautiful badges are truly under studied here.

[peterm]

Hi Miro!

Beautiful badges!!!

The last one isn't really a "ROAG"-badge. It was given to Observers and the men in the balloons. The correct name of the badge is "Luftfahrerabzeichen".

Kind regards, Peter

[morel5000]

Thanks Miro or this informative presention

Best regards,
Michel

[Miro O]

Hi Miro!

Beautiful badges!!!

The last one isn't really a "ROAG"-badge. It was given to Observers and the men in the balloons. The correct name of the badge is "Luftfahrerabzeichen".

Kind regards, Peter

Yes, it was only joke, that´s why I used "".

Miro

[peterm]

Yes, it was only joke, that´s why I used "".

Miro

Sorry Miro, I didn't recognize that.

Kind regards, Peter

[Miro O]

Sorry Miro, I didn't recognize that.

Kind regards, Peter

No problem. Thanks all for responses.

Miro

[Elmar Lang]

Hello,

it's Always interesting to read discussions about Imperial Austrian orders and decorations (that are my favourite theme).

Just to give a little, further information, the "Luftfahrerabzeichen" illustrated in post nr. 6, is also a copy made by messrs. Horvath of Budapest...

It is perhaps the best of their series of copies.

E.L.

[Miro O]

Hello,

it's Always interesting to read discussions about Imperial Austrian orders and decorations (that are my favourite theme).

Just to give a little, further information, the "Luftfahrerabzeichen" illustrated in post nr. 6, is also a copy made by messrs. Horvath of Budapest...

It is perhaps the best of their series of copies.

E.L.

Thanks for response, Elmar. Fortunately, this "Luftfahrerabzeichen" is not in my collection.

Would you be so kind and post photos of original badge for future reference?

Thanks in advance, Miro

[Elmar Lang]

Hello,

unfortunately, I haven't my original Luftfahrerabzeichen anymore: it went away some years ago, with other pieces, when I did a strong effort in order to obtain an order, then missing in my collection. Now, I have two "archive pieces" only, in other words the Horvath copy and a fine, post-1918 piece, made by Rothe & Neffe.

A friend of mine has a good, original Zimbler piece and it seems he would agree to sell it. If this would happen, I will have a piece to take the place that's now empty...