I've never seen a faked patina that convinced me. If anything, it's so obviously faked on those crosses with spots. It's not a layer, it's a coloring on the fakes. This is an authentic 1870 EKII on a bar.
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Come on George, we all know your secrets.
Here's another EK, this one beyond any question, with that heavy kind of patina. von Etzel wore this bar a lot and the cross has orange rust. Orange rust you say? Yes orange rust. Cross kept in a humidity controlled bank vault, so it's not recent
This is an EARLY EKII on a politically incorrect bar.
So now that I've put myself out there by saying the fakers haven't gotten this patina layer right, can anyone show a fake of this heavy black patina?
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Well, this thread died a death....but I have to say I remain very bothered by the fact that, between e-bay, militaria-web, Philipp Militaria & Andre Huesken, I could pick up another 4 of these very rare bars immediately...
I remain frustratingly unconvinced...Comment
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And if you wanted to you could pick up several RK's without looking very hard. It's all what you do or don't believe. For me it's not what someone tells me to believe it's a fact for me these are genuine. These were made by Wagner, period. So naturally any that turn up would be by Wagner. There's nothing fake about these. About a thousand or so of these. One for the medal bar and maybe one for a ribbon device through buttonholes. So say 1,500 or so plus a few in supply maybe 1,600 conservatively. What about the RK? Divide that number somehow by the different manufacturers. Not many more per manufacturer but there seem to always be a Junckers RK to be had. Make them fake? No. I picked mine up and was extremely worried until I had it in hand and examined it thoroughly. I figure when and if they become accepted they'll jump huge in value due to scarcity. Maybe only a similar number of S&L RK's out there but there are many more makers of RK's than these.Comment
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If the bars shown in this thread are not good, what does a good one look like? The examples posted here match the examples shown in every reference book I can think of. If there is another, "better" Wagner bar out there, can someone post a picture of it?GeorgeComment
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From what I can see it looks like ours but without the beading.Comment
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Where is that from Brian?
MarshallComment
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Good timing, just walked in.
Sadly, I don't know. The bar is correct but was the device(s) added on to enhance? Not sure. But I can tell by the ribbon at least that the ek ribbon is original. What else I just don't know.
My thoughts all along were that there was a version without the beads. That's because of the old book with photos showing it and the author's insistence it was right. But then the same author came back later and insisted the one with the beads was correct.
So what was HE saying? He changed his mind? Both are OK? The thread's not easily found for some reason, maybe gone. But that old set of books left us all rather unsure. I do remember someone saying that particular author had NO patience for fakes. I thought I kept photos from that but I can't find them. If I do I'll bring them up again. But, that indication from the author that he now liked the beaded examples gave me the courage to shell out the 500 euros for one of these. And I'm not sorry I did.Comment
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Look at this one Gordon W posted two years ago.Comment
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Werner has one on a bar but I can't tell what it is??? wnickel???Comment
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Brian
I remember this post from Gordon.....and took great heart in it...until I realised that the EK2 was (probably) this one ......which kind of dampened the euphoria....
What was the 'old book' in the thread you can't find...can you remember?
MarshallComment
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I would be very interested to see a better pic of the one in post #32 in this thread..Spange to 1870 Iron Cross? by Stogieman also.....Comment
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dare
...I would normally not dare to mouth my opinion on Iron Crosses (ever), but all WHS I had over the last 2 decades having were mounted on medal bars with provinience and did not have a makers mark on the reverse. They had either prongs or the slip bar.Comment
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All,
I have two of these one is a standard size Wagner with the round pins and the other is a miniature on a ribbon bar. I cannot post photos but the ribbon bar is as follows : 1870 EK with mini spange, Red Eagle Order with crown and swords, peace HHO, peace RAO, Long Service, 1870-71 Service medal, Colonial General Service medal, Kaiser Wilhelm I commemortive medal.
Daniel MurphyComment
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