"golden" EK 1....

[Donnerwetter]

Hello everyone! I´m new to this forum, so please excuse me if I start a thread that might have been discussed many times before....I will eventually improve my search-skills......

During a trip to Germany last year I aquired this EK 1. Generally a nice quality cross but what obviously caught my special interest was the golden appearance. I knew that there existed variations with brass centers instead of the iron ones, but that they also produced crosses with silverplated brass frames I didn´t know.

Obviously a private purchase piece, both due to the material used and the fact that it is a vaulted cross, but does anyone know if these where made during the war years or in the 20-30:ies? Have anyone seen them listed in period manufacturers/dealers catalogs? Any info is greatly appreciated.

[Donnerwetter]

And the reverse.....

[Donnerwetter]

...and finally an angle-shot....

[Thomas H]

Hey hundingsbane,

Listen to this, I quote from 'The Iron Time' page 165.

While iron was readably available, silver was always to be hunted down. Those seeking it for military decorations often had to wait in line behind more urgent wartime necessities. The result; brass frames occasionally replaced silver.

So this one can be pre 1918.

Regards Thomas

[Tim Tezer]

Hey hundingsbane,

Listen to this, I quote from 'The Iron Time' page 165.

While iron was readably available, silver was always to be hunted down. Those seeking it for military decorations often had to wait in line behind more urgent wartime necessities. The result; brass frames occasionally replaced silver.

So this one can be pre 1918.

Regards Thomas

...but it's probably not. The hinge and pin are typical 3rd Reich style, i.e. 1930's or 1940's.

It's too bad it has lost so much finish. Poor thing. I trust it has now found a good home, where it will be in better care.

Tim

[Donnerwetter]

Thanks Thomas!

I have the book but I had overlooked that part, been some time since I read it through... So, the conclusion is that it can very well be pre 1918.

I find it interesting that this recipient obviously wore it for quite some time even when the cross had turned almost completely "gold". Maybe he found he got even more attention with a golden iron cross.....but on the other hand he might have been mistaken for a recipient of the Mecklenburg-Schwerin Militärverdienstkreuz which for a Prussian might have been less fun....

[Rich G]

I would agree that this style of hinge is 30's style. The majority of these EK1's with this set up seem to be plated brass and non-iron cores. I have noticed that the silver finish is not that robust and tends to wear off.

Rich

[Donnerwetter]

Oops! Differing opinion! Interesting, I had thought that hinge type was pre-Third Reich period (even though it might not be pre-1918) but I´m open for new information! Best way to learn more!

[Donnerwetter]

Ok, sometime during the 30:ies, sounds reasonable. Has anyone seen a period advertisment for silverplated brass-framed crosses? I suppose they should also exist in 2nd class, since the major contributing factor to their existance was material shortages!?

[Thomas H]

...but it's probably not. The hinge and pin are typical 3rd Reich style, i.e. 1930's or 1940's.

Previtera speaks about late war manufacturing with this form of hinge attachment to the backplate (page 199). Is he mistaking here, or are there also a few made like this in 1918?

I suppose they should also exist in 2nd class, since the major contributing factor to their existance was material shortages!?

Page 165 is actually taking about a second class.

Thomas

[Donnerwetter]

Hello Thomas!


Now I have Previteras book right here with me! The answer to the 2nd class issue was there already in Your first post. Thanks!

Also noticed Previteras remark about the hinge-style beeing late-war. Unfortunately nothing more to substanciate that and I have looked over my other books and there is nothing to help date this cross. I notice many Prinzen 1914 EK 1:s as well as "Schinkel" 1939 EK 1:s have that style of hinge, which together with Previteras statement means this cross could be anything from late WWI to early WWII!?

Peter

[Mike Kenny]

Hi,

This hinge/pin construction was definitely in use as early as 1919/1920, as the earliest Stahlhelm Diensteintritt (tradition) badge incorporated the same assembly. It would not surprise me to find out that the hinge/pin configuration was in use in 1918, but this would be hard to proove. The hinge/pin configuration was used on many 20s/30s awards, from veteran's associations to high end Third Reich awards. The hinge/pin configuration was in use until at least 1941, as the earliest DKs (10 and 6 rivet examples) also used it. It is not common during WW2, although Wernstein used a SIMILAR (but not the same) type of folded over hinge on many of it's zinc awards.

For me, there is no way to date hundingsbane's example - it could be anywhere from late WW1 to early WW2. IF the cross in question has any die flaws on the beading, then it is almost certainly late 30's / early WW2. Fyi, my two examples have iron (magnetic) cores but my 1939 Schinkel EK1 (which uses the frames from the same die) has a non-magnetic core.

Also, for me based solely on the images, hundingsbane's example looks recently cleaned as the tombak is bright - no patina!

Regards
Mike K

[Eric Stahlhut]

Here's the same type in slightly better condition with an LDO case, which means the cross was kitted out post March 1941:

[Eric Stahlhut]

reverse:

[Eric Stahlhut]

closeup of cased LDO cross. Sorry for bad pic.