private purchase EK 2 on estand

[Don D.]

for discussion: http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=627871

[Gew44]

IMHO
Only the band is original , modern engravure (Font type and no patina inside the words), without solid provenance/proof is a dangerous cross.

Thats are only my 2 cents

[HenrikKH]

It has lots of patina in the engraving... Is you only issue it has no provenance??

That's a lame statement...

Regards Henrik

[Roglebk]

Remeber this cross from somewhere else, maybe German ebay. Didn't like it then and don't like it now.

Cross is one piece made, doesn't match any of the known 'one pieces'. Low quality enamel. Engravings have been made with a engraving machine, not hand made as expected. Fonts looks modern. Not sure about ribbon and mount.

Oxide in engraving doesn't mean anything. It can be created very easy.

Sorry Henrik but this is as bad it can be imo.

[gregM]

I have to agree with what's already been said.
Cheaply made fake.

[Brian L.]

I have to agree with what's already been said.
Cheaply made fake.

I'm not an EK collector per se, but have certainly had my fair share of them over the years.

I agree this is not in any way an EK. But, what I think is that it's a somewhat cheaply made souvenir from the period; likely 1920s, maybe off a watch-fob. If you look closely, the engraving does have considerable patina inside it and I actually think it's legit. Maybe it was a gift from a wife to her husband. Also the comment about it being a modern font (there are actually 3 font styles) is nonsense. The main inscription and the italic dates are a rounded sans serif typical of Bauhaus style fonts from the 1920s. The "Verdun" inscription is a style of cursive type also quite common in the 20s and 30s.

So, while it isn't what the seller proports it to be, and is likely worth only a few Euros as a curiosity, I think at least it's a period piece and not intended to deceive.

[römischIX]

the ribbon seems to be good - the cross is a patriotic item.

mr. hackebeil served also at verdun he was a vizefeldwebel.

but i don`t think that the engraving is original.

have a look at niemann page 126

[rick1]

Engravings of the period do not have all the same width as this one does. Done with an engraver.

[AlikN]

Nothing like period engraving and period enameling usually looks much better.

[Brian L.]

Engravings of the period do not have all the same width as this one does. Done with an engraver.

Machine engravers have existed since the 19th century. The one I'm thinking of had a stylus on one arm used to trace a font template. The other arm with the engraving needle was adjustable for size, allowing for the template to be a larger, more easily traceable size, but the actual engraving to be (as in this case) much smaller.

[Roglebk]

Machine engravers have existed since the 19th century. The one I'm thinking of had a stylus on one arm used to trace a font template. The other arm with the engraving needle was adjustable for size, allowing for the template to be a larger, more easily traceable size, but the actual engraving to be (as in this case) much smaller.

Have used one of those, modern made. Engraved plastic signs for identifying trees and other plants on a School for Gardeners.

Please show some WWI period, machine engraved items.

[AlikN]

Machine engravers have existed since the 19th century. The one I'm thinking of had a stylus on one arm used to trace a font template. The other arm with the engraving needle was adjustable for size, allowing for the template to be a larger, more easily traceable size, but the actual engraving to be (as in this case) much smaller.

I do know how it works, we discussed this before, here is the link post#12
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=482298

I never heard 19th century template engraving machine, Hermes was - is one of the leading makers of those and first one for jeweler's use was made in late 1930's, if you have any other info I would love to see it.

[Brian L.]

I do know how it works, we discussed this before, here is the link post#12
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=482298

I never heard 19th century template engraving machine, Hermes was - is one of the leading makers of those and first one for jeweler's use was made in late 1930's, if you have any other info I would love to see it.

I don't have a photo nor any other hard evidence at hand. I only know that my sister's father-in-law, his father and his grandfather were all jewelry engravers. He had all the family's machines dating back to the 19th century. I distinctly remember his grandfather's engraver which was dark green cast iron or steel (not sure which) with brass fittings and patented 1879.

[AlikN]

With out seeing it, it's hard to say what type of enraving machine or other jeweler's tool was that, but from the info that is available on line it looks like those type of machines were available for jewelers from 1930's on.

http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-pa...h-engraver.htm

And here is the link to the New Hermes Inc. site,

and there is .... quote: "1938 Creation of New Hermes by Norbert SCHIMMEL and 1st pantograph engraver invention"

http://www.e-engraving.com/machines/...rmes/index.htm

[Roglebk]

Here's what seems to be a machine engraved item from 1915:

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=629607