1894 and 1914 prussian ranklists

[Sal Williams]

Hi Imperialoids,
I just got the Prussian 1894 and 1914 ranklists. If anyone needs info from them just PM me. Rickey, if they do have questions I will need your help to actually be able to use the darned things .
Best, Sal

[Rick Research]

Ahhhh... mysterious symbols "helpfully" arranged NOT in the order they were WORN in

Didja check to see if the original owners' wrote their names in the inside covers?

[Rick Research]

The Loremasters' "trick," of course is to "Visualize Da Reebonz."

Can you spot THIS guy up there? (Remember: the List is PRE-war, May 1914, so 1st, 7th, and 9th ribbons on this M1915 bar can't be listed-- they didn't exist... yet.)

[Sal Williams]

The 1914 seems to have a name that I cant read and the 1894 was owned by Herr 35 Euros . Rick, I think I'm gonna need lessons! You can probably expect my usual PM bombardment to commence soon .
What are the letters in the old German that look all funky again? I used to know but I have forgotten. The one that looks like an F is actually an S correct?
Best, Sal

[Rick Research]

Herr 35 Euros! Post scan of signature... sometimes...

Bs and Vs are "fun" too. People think this is "easy."

Example:

Here's our lad, Wolfgang Freiherr zu Inn- und- Knyphausen (1868-1926)--

[Rick Research]

And note where he is actually wearing the numbered awards from the List:

the solid yellow ribbon in unnumbered fifth position here is the 1897 Wilhelm I Centenary Medal, which is never shown on Prussian and Navy lists, but must be inferred from seniority. And the Bavarian Military Merit Order 4th Class with Crown on statute ribbon in last unnumbered spot here? Why isn't THAT showing? Because he had it gazetted 20 June 1914, and the Rank List is from May--and there was not another List showing awards until... 1924!

[Sal Williams]

Rick,
I was trying to decipher it from the key in my 1914 book and I couldn't at all! are the keys different from year to year? Which one did that come out of? I could find no RAO with AmKr after it
Best, Sal

[Sal Williams]

Well i see by the page it is the same book as mine but where doues it tell you the code for AmKr? I am assuming it means Adler mit Krone?

[Rick Research]

Prussia lists their own awards FIRST in the front pages, with little EMBLEMS for some Orders like the REO and CO. Just to make life "interesting," since Württemberg is also in there, in the back, they do the same thing with THEIR native awards-- so Prussia used symbols for their own and abbreviations for the Württemberg awards, while--same bat book, same bat channel-- Württemberg used symbols for their native stuff and abbreviations for the Prussian ones!

Prussia:

Red Eagle Order 4 = plain flat cross with circle center and "4"

but in the Wtbg section, same thing is a "PRAO4."

Württemberg:

Friedrich Order-Knight 1st Class is a mini symbol of the Cross with rays and "3a"

but in the Pruss section, same thing is a "WF3a."

BOTH however, use a plain enter cross with three dots in each arm to equal their XXV Years Service Cross. But in Prussia's part the Wtbg one was a "WMD1" and in Wtbg's part the Pruss is "PDK." Meanwhile, the XX years Cross is NOT, as you might expect, same cross all plain (looked too much like the Red Eagle symbol?) but "LD1"....


Oooooooooooooooo!


I was normal-- before all this!

[Sal Williams]

AAArghhhh, Well at least they are pretty books to look at . I cant figure it out . I found the Saxon one but can't decipher the 3a part. and I am pretty sure the mKr means mit krone but it doesn't show that in the key as far as I can tell

[Rick Research]

"mKr" "XaR" etc are at the END of the Prussian/Hohenzollern award abbreviations part as (theoretically) common to all awards: top of page XIX, 1914.

The classes list under each Order. So Saxon Albert Order ("SA") Knight 1st "3a" is on p XXI, no mention of "mKr" from p. XIX because you've already read that (in 1914).

See? Eeeeeeeeeeeeeasy.

You're going to need either:

a) a Really Big Haircut or

b) tightly braided pigtails ("Cherokee nation, Cherokee triiiibe...")

before you start pulling your hair out!

[Sal Williams]

The veil begins to lift, but I better learn quick to avoid that haircut!
Thanks Rick!
How about another quiz page?

[Rick Research]

1914

Mister Scanner prefers a three minute workday, after a full night's rest!

And the prize for Most Sensational German Medal Bar In Existence goes tooooo

[Daniel Krause]

yup, Veith, he was the only one ever encounted to wear 3 Prussian lifesaving decorations plus two Turkish ones. I just wonder what he did to earn them.

Best regards

Daniel

[Rick Research]

char. Generalmajor aD Georg Veit (1863-1931)

In 1907 he had NO lifesaving awards. In the Orders Almanac 1908/09 he had the Prussian Lifesaving Medal = ONE.

He then... vanishes reappearing (I have no Rank Lists between issues of 1907 and 1912. Veit is NOT in the 1912. Nor is he in the Seniority Lists for 1910 and 1911.) in 1913 with a normal Red Eagle Order 4 and... the Prussian Crown Order 3rd Class on Lifesaving Medal Ribbon = TWO.

Between the 1913 and 1914 Rank List issues, he adds the bizarre Red Eagle Order 3rd Class with BOW (statute Red Eagle Order ribbon--bow???!!!) on the Lifesaving Medal ribbon AND the Turkish Lifesaving Medals "on red ribbon" AND "on green ribbon." = 3,4, and 5. Now, even assuming he got the Red Eagle one and ONE of the Turkish ones as "doubles" for the same act (one would presume the Turks didn't give him TWO medals for ONE deed) that is still at least FOUR lifesaving actions, if NOT five. And Veit was FIFTY YEARS OLD in 1913!

Furthermore...

he was in GERMANY 1913 on...

so why the double Ottoman awards? Especially since he ALSO got the Gold AND Silver Imtiaz medals from them both gazetted 12 April 1914. I mean, how clumsy could Prince Mustafa on a military school course have BEEN? "Oh dear, let me rescue you again, Highness."