Colonial Bars

[Bobby lee]

Hey fellows, I recently bought an item from a fellow in Deutschland. He additionally offered me 12 colonial bars. I offer them here for your opinion.

[Bobby lee]

reverse

[Bobby lee]

second set

[Bobby lee]

reverse, I see good aspects as well as some possible issues, I am interested in what my fellow collectors think.

[Arran]

reverse, I see good aspects as well as some possible issues, I am interested in what my fellow collectors think.

Well, a good aspect is they're all bang-on, but I see an issue in the fact that they're a little TOO consistent with regards to finish and construction. In a collection of bars like this, wouldn't you expect to see some with flat prongs, or a different guage of prong? Or a different shade of gilding? I think these have all been produced by the same hand, and that raises some questions in my mind...just my opinion...

Cheers,
Arran.

[Bobby lee]

Hello Arran, I agree. The bars look very well made and do resemble some originals. However, to find so many, some very scarce (see the 'Afrika' bar) and all in near mint condition raises red flags to me. Perhaps this is another example of why we should be very careful and question what may be too good to be true. If they are oriinals, wow, what a find!

[Christian L]

yes, many very rare ones - and same way of production!
its very difficult to judge.
if you take only one, than it could be a good find - what would you than say?
possitive or negative?
after that, take all and give them the same vote!
best regards christian

[Rick Research]

Another problem is SCANS. Every original bar I have ever seen has been fire-gilt with matte and polished parts.

The fakes I have seen are just BRASS, buffed like hell. I've got one, and am unable to get a good scan of it because it is too shiny. Those are also found dull brown "aged," which no original bar ever was. You'd only have a good way to judge with them IN HAND.

I'm afraid my sole experience with these is IN bars, so reverse details of loose ones are beyond me.

There are indeed so many varieties that it would be difficult to say with any certainty WHEN they were actually MADE. My medal bars with them, as here, date from the 1930s-- so are these "original" 1914 bars remounted, or fresh from the outfitters' parts box in 1938?

[Rick Research]

Again, it is a "scan issue," but on some of the above, the background pebbling or cross hatching does not seem sharp and clear. There should be no "wear" on never issued parts bars, sitting in a box all these decades.

[Christian L]

you are right rick - but you will find also original clasps which lost all the fire gilt!
(because of heating them for attaching or reattaching the prongs).
also the dies (prägewerkzeuge) are after producing a couple not in "unused" condition, the maker of these also cut notevery time 100% and air also contents parts that are not that good for them.
and what about cut off ones from medalbars?
so i think its also possible to find not shiny and "bad looking" ones which are original.
also the variety of used dies (prägewerkzeuge) is, to my knowledge, unknown.
christian

[Brian S]

Rick, several medal bars are now appearing on eBay Germany w/the addition of repro battle bars. I haven't looked for the colonials bearing extra bars but if the battle bars are struck on, the other bars will also be stuck on. Great bars are being ruined with ugly holes from these little pins.

These don't look like cheap brass copies I've seen but they look like they lack some detail to edges inside the bar edge. But they don't match a particular maker so how do you know what they should look like. Very tricky.

Here's a good HOPHU different style. I'd look for ones that match what you know are good on medal bars and ignore the rest.

[Brian S]

Same vet medal bar about 10 years later, different manufacturer;

[stogieman]

Interesting.....

The "graining" on Brian's looks very fine, while Rick's look more like cross-hatching. Since I know the sources of both bars, I have no doubt as to authenticity so we have at least 2 makers. What was the deal with the bars, weren't they a private-purchase item? I forget the regs now....

[Brian S]

The "graining" on Brian's looks very fine, while Rick's look more like cross-hatching. Since I know the sources of both bars, I have no doubt as to authenticity so we have at least 2 makers. What was the deal with the bars, weren't they a private-purchase item? I forget the regs now....

As long as you're on the colonial regs what are the regs on the 1870-1 Battle Bars?

1870-1 GOT to be private purchase... Rgt. history puts you down for EXACTLY what battles you were in but 25 years later how did you get those bars? I don't think they issued vouchers in those days.