1870 EK1 'I' Wagner...Opinions..?

[Biro]

I.Wagner 14 LOTH. 1870 EK1

After all the ker-fuffle over these recently, is anyone brave enough to give an opinion on this??

Marked I.Wagner & S. 14 LOTH - with an umlaut over the 'O'

No other pics yet...

Regards..

[Biro]

Maker Mark (what there is of it..)

[Blitz]

Atleast the pin is what i would expect from an original.. However i'm not quite sure about the numbers, and the makers mark+silver stamp, could we get a closeup of the reverse?

[Bill M]

--Hmmmm...really need to see the '1' on the reverse.
--Typical "I" from the front? No. I'll be back...

[George Stimson]

For better or worse ( ) the obverse die characteristics don't match mine.

[Biro]

Thanks boys, sorry Antti - no more pics...

Any takers on this as a match with Page 116 - Iron Time..??

If the 'I' and the '1' in the '14 Loth' maker mark is OK (obscured here, so wont know till/if I receive it) then I'm starting to get a better feeling about this cross.....

(Bill - I know you had correspondance with him... any word on Detlevs opinion of the cross middle left page 116??? He's on GODDAMN holiday !!)

cheers..Mines on the right..

[Biro]

Crown...

[Biro]

'w'....

[Biro]

Date...

[Tim Tezer]

If this is a fake, then we're in real trouble. It looks very good from the photos, although it's hard to tell how deep the relief is on the core. On the originals, the raised portions come right up to about the height of the frame beading. Is that the case on this one?

Tim

[Eric Stahlhut]

By the end of this month everyone will be absolutely PETRIFIED to post their '70 EKs!

has the catch been reattached?

[Bill M]

--There is that 'overlapping 8' that everyone is afraid of, only seen by me, until this point, on 'J' crosses. This makes me nervous in a way as I know what to expect from good 'J' and good 'I' crosses (yes I still believe some 'J's are good), and this may turn that on it's head. Crown looks good, I'd like to see it closer (of course).
--Neeeeeed to see that '1', but then again - that might toss us a curve here as well....
--Have to go up and find the correspondence with Detlev. I don't recall mention of pg 116, but maybe...

[Bobby lee]

Hello fellows. I have a question regarding Detlev. Having never met the gentleman or done business with him, I wonder what makes him such an expert in the field over other German, English or American dealers? I have seen a good deal of 'gushing' over this name in a number of threads over the past two years as well as sorrows at not getting to his items first. As I mentioned in another thread, I believe there is an inherent conflict of interest when a dealer is relied on for determining what is real and what is not. Thats true for them all. I am not suggesting seeking advice from any person but it should be put in proper perspective. Besides, I do know this Detlev has made errors in judgement on at least one item. I suspect he is human and therefore not infallible. I just don't understand the position many at this forum have placed him in relationship to others. Just curious.

[Brian S]

Look how awful that 70's Wiederholungsspange was compared to the real one in the details. This just doesn't look like 60's or 70's repros. It's too good. Two Wagner EK1 styles...

[Biro]

It's too good. Two Wagner EK1 styles?...

BrianS..

Thanks...
I guess its an option. After all, they have TWO Maker Marks...Right? ..

Good to hear everyone here so far is at least 50/50 on it.
I guess that's as unanimous as it's gonna get....


BobbyLee...

Granted, he does appear to have 'messiah' like status, but

1 - He's handled inspected and researched more Iron Crosses than..(you know the rest.)
2 - With a contentious item like the 1870 EK1, if it has a C.O.A. and approval from Detlev Niemann, (and remember, this is just his 'opinion' in writing')...the reality is you can be sure that, oneday, you WILL be able to re-sell it....

As much as I respect and enjoy the opinions of all the guys here, I'm afraid I can't quite say the same for any of them......yet!
(OK, maybe with one exception..)

For me, it's that simple.