1870 EK2 with 25-Year Oak Leaves

[streptile]

I just received a cross that has basically convinced me that Greg is correct in his interpretation of this one. I think it is a WWI replacement cross, discernible, as Greg said initially, by the fewer and differently-shaped jewels in the headband of the obverse Crown, and the wider 'W.'

I will post some photos and an explanation of my cross in a new thread, but I'm really convinced that Greg nailed it.

By the way, I'd say that makes this rarer than a standard Type A, if not necessarily more desirable.

[streptile]

Here is why I believe this cross was made in WWI.

I have a cross similar to it, that I know was made in WWI, and the features are the same, in my opinion.

The reverse is a typical Type A on both:





The Obverse crown is the same, I think, on both:





...And the "fat W" that Greg noticed is also the same on both:





...So:

If my cross was definitely made during WWI, I believe the original piece was, too.

[gregM]

Trevor,
Is that a WuS maker's mark?

[streptile]

Trevor,
Is that a WuS maker's mark?

Good eye, Greg. You're batting 1000.

I'm also surprised that no one has yet asked me how I know for sure that my cross was made during WWI...

[gregM]

Several hints.
1)You said you "knew" it was made in 1914.
2)You did (not) say that you had a matching 1870.
3)You never pictured the date.
4)maker marked ring

It's a ww1 (or later) cross.

The only other thing would be if you got ahold of a grouping with
the award document.

[streptile]

Yeah, I guess that kind of gives it away.

For myself, I am extremely happy to have found this cross, the first one I have ever personally seen. Remember the reworked Type B seen HERE?

This is a reworked Type A, marked 'WuS' for Wagner und Sohn:

[Montgomery Burns]

so it means that tools ( fore the sand mould ) are used from the 1870 ek in the beginning off ww1 fore the 1914 ek



and those tools are separate tools fore ,crown ,,the W ,,the date ,,the leaves and so on
used fore the design off the core

and that is WY everyone is so confused about core's and makers off the ek2 1914 ,,

they used the tools randomly( or by choice off the jeweller ) fore every client who ordered core's at the metal casting factory .



















;

[streptile]

so it means that tools ( fore the sand mould ) are used from the 1870 ek in the beginning off ww1 fore the 1914 ek...

I agree with you, and that is precisely what I find so fascinating about this cross. Like the 'S-W' reworked 1870 Type B, this cross is undoubtedly among the earliest crosses made and awarded in WWI. Made also before sand-casting was replaced by die-stamping for cores.

...and those tools are separate tools fore ,crown ,,the W ,,the date ,,the leaves and so on ...

I'm not so sure I agree with you about this. I think the molds were more likely single pieces for the obverse and reverse cores. This one just has a crown that is quite obviously based on the traditional 1870 Type A crown -- the overall, slightly lopsided shape is the same, and there are other similarities. But the reverse of this 'WuS' is identical to an 1870 Type A.

[Montgomery Burns]

I

'm not so sure I agree with you about this. I think the molds were more likely single pieces for the obverse and reverse cores. This one just has a crown that is quite obviously based on the traditional 1870 Type A crown -- the overall, slightly lopsided shape is the same, and there are other similarities. But the reverse of this 'WuS' is identical to an 1870 Type A.

well I have my hansen type core ek2's 1914 ,,,,,they are showing just that kind off tool similarity's ...( pressing and sand mould production )

but maybe it is just retooling ,,but aim still intrigued about it
and looking fore the answers ,,,

youre ek is one off the new examples that points in to the right direction ,,

and until now ,,you're one off the few collector a seen here that dos not only try to stuck up his collection without a second look ,,,
but also researches in to new grounds .....leaving old standard believes behind you ...
you're braking ground fore future collectors here Trevor ,,,,,

and I like it

regards kay

O a nother example off 1870 ek 1914 fore you below

[streptile]

Kay, that WWI-made 1870 you show should have been mine!

Honestly, I've been looking for this exact type for a long time now. Well... a year or so. I can't believe I missed it on eBay.

...and until now ,,you're one off the few collector a seen here that dos not only try to stuck up his collection without a second look ,,, but also researches in to new grounds,,,,and I like it

Thanks for your very nice words, too . I find this kind of comparative analysis and typing to be very rewarding and fun.

[Montgomery Burns]

Kay, that WWI-made 1870 you show should have been mine!

Honestly, I've been looking for this exact type for a long time now. Well... a year or so. I can't believe I missed it on eBay.

if there is one ,,there are more ,,eventually nothing is to rare to be found .





















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