A Study of the Rothe Style PlM

[Les]

Interesting and informative thread. Les, don't forget that the BRD does award the PLM for Arts and Sciences. My uncle is a current member of the order.

Vince, the civil order was not part of the military order and not technically part of the Allied laws banning the wearing of military awards, etc.

The first post-war award of the civil order took place in 1952 when the civil award was re-instituted by the BRD.

[VtwinVince]

Agreed. However, you made a blanket statement that the BRD never awarded the PLM.

[Steve P]

Another Roethe PLM

This is another Roethe PLM piece that I thought I would put up as an example...It has the same characteristics as the first one in this thread but is in the cornflower blue colour ather than the sky blue (without oakleavs).

[Steve P]

The blue of the cross appears lighter in this pic due to ight. I will take some more pics soon and upload them.

[Steve P]

Reverse (apologies it's a bit fuzzy)

[regular122]

Thanks Steve for posting that cross. Definitely fits the style. I think the darker blue is a good sign. The light blue ones are the ones that raise the most suspicion with me. This cross compares favorably to the initial one posted as an example of the style.

Is it marked in any way? Any idea on dimensions? Thanks, Steve

[Steve P]

Hi Steve,

You're welcome...the cross is not marked as I understand is typical of the Roethe PLMand the ribbon is also typical of the Roethe firm as I understand...I don't have the photoshop software to mark lines on the pics but If someone would care to mark lines on the cross I will provide dimensions for the piece (Plese name the lines so I can give dimensions that correspond if this can be done).

I have also attached a couple more photos of the piece. Perhaps if someone uses Pic #2 for the dimension photo-shopping it may be best (if they would care to do so).

[Steve P]

Pic # 2

[Steve P]

Pic # 3

[regular122]

Thanks Steve. The chart below is useful. I think it came from a forum member here but is a pretty good guide. Also basics as below:

Specifications
Width - 00.00 mm
Height - 00.00 mm
Marks - cross, arm ray location & loop or none

Thanks for the great pics. Steve

[Elmar Lang]

Hello,

I would like to post here, what I've said in the "main" PlM discussion:

just to add something new, in a recently published book, Ferenc Fekete and Attila Baum: "A Magyar Királyság Kitüntései 1920-1945" Budapest, HK Hermanos Kiadó, 2010, on pages 20 and 42, there are full-page pictures of Field Marshal Archduke Joseph (in the uniform used during the regency period of Admiral Horthy), visibly wearing a Rothe-type Pour le Mérite with Oak Leaves among his other highest, Imperial Austrian orders and decorations: all of them look of pre-1918 manufacture, so I think that also the Prussian order could be from the same period. Anyways, it is a pre-1945 piece, due to the date the pictures were taken.

I hope this would help a little.

Best wishes,

Elmar Lang

[StefanK.]

I'd like to show you my PLM from Rothe which I believe could be pre 1918 (I would be glad to hear your opinions as well).


The PLM is a little bit different that the others shown in this thread because the crown is more narrow and the Me'rite is lacking the "=". Moreover the piece is correctly marked with the Austrian hallmarks "A", "Diana's head" (900 silver) and "FR". These hallmarks were used between 1872 and 1922. Considering the fact that producing PLM in Austria was rather useless before 1914 and after 1918, I personally believe that the cross was produced somewhen between 1914 and 1918, most likely in the last year(s) of the war.



I tried to make some good pictures; i would be glad to hear some of your opinions.


Greetings, Stefan

[StefanK.]

more

[StefanK.]

markings and details

[StefanK.]

more details